String Jammer
(Planeteer)
08/14/10 03:12 AM
Brad's left Sweetwater

Now I need to give all of my money to another sales engineer. Shucks. \:\(

bmushal
(Planeteer)
08/14/10 04:00 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

http://redirectingat.com/?id=690X1299&xs...yons-story.html

bmushal
(Planeteer)
08/14/10 04:01 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

http://redirectingat.com/?id=690X1299&xs...yons-story.html

JazAddict
(Planeteer)
08/14/10 04:21 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Looks more like Sweetwater left him...
Sorry to hear it Brad. Best of luck.


Randyman...
(Planeteer)
08/14/10 06:57 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Wow!

Avid throwing their weight around, huh? Like the threads mentioned - why would Avid tell any salespeople something that essentially requires an NDA disclosure to be signed? Why would Avid leak CONFIDENTIAL product release info to 3rd party SALESPEOPLE if they didn't specifically WANT it to get leaked???

This seems like an obvious case of pure intent on the part of Avid IMNSHO.

Brad - I'm sure you will prosper in your field of expertise. Don't let this idiotic political/promotional setup crush your good will towards music production. I know we've had our exchanges (all in good fun on my part \:\) ), but you are a talented musician and engineer that deserves to make a descent living off your real world experiences...

I got a nagging call from Brad's prospective replacement a few days ago inquiring incessantly about my equipment needs . It might have even been before "the writing was on the wall". That just makes me respect Brad's sales approach towards me even more (Brad knew my "style", and was hands off - not all in my face like this "replacement guy" is!)

I wish you the best in your future escapades. Make some lemonade with this shit!!! I know there's some "launch potential" lurking with your situation - you just need to find the appropriate way to tap into it!



havlicek
(Planeteer)
08/14/10 11:53 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Total bullshit, I've had my differences over the years with Brad, but there's never been a doubt in my mind that he was ALWAYS on the clock for Sweetwater, as well as Avid. If anything, the person who leaked the info to Brad should have been the one who was cut and there would always be ways to find out who that was without putting Brad on the spot as a snitch. Brad has hinted in the past in sufficiently vague terms at coming products, services, events and it's clear that was always to drive interest (and hopefully future sales) towards Sweetwater. This is corporate garbage, done daily as if nothing is at stake...yet people's lives are hanging in the balance. Sweetwater lost an asset here, to be replaced with a numb-nuts corporate robo-clone no doubt.

-john


cajun
(Planeteer)
08/14/10 04:43 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

There was a post on Gearslutz called the Brad Lyons Story. NOw it's gone? Can't seem to find it.

shanabit
(Planeteer)
08/14/10 04:54 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

 Originally Posted By: cajunx
There was a post on Gearslutz called the Brad Lyons Story. NOw it's gone? Can't seem to find it.


GS is way too PC these days, place used to rock . It sucks now


Doughboy
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/14/10 05:54 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Wow.....good luck Brad. Best of luck to ya man.

gonzo
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/14/10 06:33 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Beyond that, there is more to the story in that this situation isn't the sole reason that Brad is no longer employed at Sweetwater. As the guy who actually hired Brad and has worked closely with him for about ten years now and gotten to know him as a friend and supported him in activities outside of work, I can tell you that this decision wasn't made lightly. Believe, me, I didn't want this to happen and had hoped that Brad would be with the company for many years to come. Unfortunately, this was not meant to be. I, like most of you, am concerned for Brad and his family. I'm sure some of you will be pretty skeptical about that coming from a "corporate guy" like me. Anybody who has worked with me or known me in my 25 plus years in the industry will know that this comes from the heart. I'm sure many of you have found that the people you work closely with tend to become sort of an extended family. This was no exception.

I understand the reaction...the shock and even anger about Brad being gone. Whether you believe me or not, this has really weighed heavily on my mind and heart (as it has with many others on our team). Unfortunately, Brad's recent and previous actions resulted in this being the "right" albeit very painful decision to make. Sweetwater did not do this to Brad, he did it to himself. I wish I could explain more, but please know that Sweetwater isn't some uncaring corporate monolith, it's a company filled with a lot of wonderful people who truly care about their work and our customers. Please also know that the other members of our sales team are as deeply committed and passionate as you've found Brad to be. I wouldn't have moved to Fort Wayne 13 years ago to work here if I didn't believe in the core values of the company and respect the people who work here. I have worked hard ever since to build upon that foundation. Sweetwater's real strength isn't any single individual, whether that's Brad, me, or even Chuck, our owner. The real strength is having a team of individuals work within solid, ethical and moral core values day in and day out. We want to do the right thing for each customer in every circumstance and treat them with the respect they deserve. Integrity and credibility are the most important assets we have as a company. We care about what you think and respect your opinions. I/we hope you will also understand that there is much more to the story and Brad's being let go than the incident with the premature post, this was just the final straw.

In closing, I sincerely hope that I've done a decent job of presenting what I am able to of "the other side" of this situation. Sorry for the long post.

Best Regards,


Jeff Radke
Vice President of Sales
Sweetwater


NOK
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/14/10 11:33 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Thank you for that input Jeff.....unless we were there , there can only be speculation.

T57Strat
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 12:55 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

He presented nothing but a political speech, empty as a meth-head's pipe.

Wishing you well, Brad. I never had a lot of dealings with you, but you seem straight up to me.


Kenex
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 01:42 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

May God go with you Brad. You can always become a King at Musicians Friend.

MadGuitrst
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 02:16 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Why not just start his own internet store, such as Front End Audio?

Doofie
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 04:31 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

I'll wait till I read what Brad has to say.

Doofie
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 04:34 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

'Course maybe he's been hit with a gag order. In which case Mr. Radke's words are meaningless. Still I'll be waiting.

NOK
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/15/10 05:02 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

I feel Brad will keep his words close to his chest as a Man will...


these are good nite words as I go to sleep


Popmann
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/15/10 05:20 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

You know...corporate is as corporate does. Tell me that immediate dismisal was the appropriate action for a long time employee who "leaked" something he shouldn't have? About another company, too, I might add. Not even about SW. So, they care SO much for getting future roadmap info that they would sacrifice one of their own?

Honestly...never really "got" Brad. Not one of my fave people hanging here...BUT...that's just wrong. Just another case of big INC sucking ass.

On the flip side of that...local store arranged for the local builder of an amp I like to come in and talk to me about prospective tweaks I'd like...and then lent me the amp for the weekend to record it and make sure it's "the one" for me. I'm sure that a big corporate store wouldn't do anything of the sort. And a corporate amp maker certainly wouldn't.

I wonder sometimes why we gravitate towards these huge corporations...yet complain to all hell about the lousy service...and their political donations (see recent Target faux pas)...and their big local tax breaks so they can underpay and mistreat our neighbors as employees. Not to mention that they homogenize America--making west Nashville just like some suburb 30 miles south of town...and neither one that different from whatever demographically similar parts of Florida or California or Iowa.

A guy locally building amps isn't going to subcontract to China, either...a big corporate entity will.

Sometimes I think the answer to getting America out of the "hell in a handbasket" fast track is simple--buy local. Publicly traded? F them. Obviously--it isn't always possible or beneficial...but, if we made that our default mode of spending our cash, would we not grow our own community and ultimately all enjoy our jobs a bit more?

I digress. Brad got the raw end of this, it seems...but, the thing is--who can be surprised? We collectively almost always get the raw end of the deal when we deal with big corporations.


havlicek
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 02:58 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

I pretty much agree with everything Pop and others said above. Of course the "attraction" to large corporations by consumers is always about bottom line. We've gotten to the point where people will routinely overlook small non-chain retailers and, almost by pure reflex go straight to the BIG chains even when it's only a matter of a couple of percent retail. It's also not unusual for the chains to offer loss leaders (because they can) and get people through the doors to spend virtually the same as they would in the "mom & pop" stores. Many consumers just assume the deals MUST ALWAYS be ass-kicking at Walmart...when it might not be the case for any particular item. Small shops may not have the inventory in many cases, but that's another thing altogether...they're at least worth first look if this (buy local) is important to people. It seems clear that Sweetwater's model has been to not cut the bottom line to the bone, although they seemed fairly competitive. Their raison d'être has been about "service", superior product knowledge and glitz. Brad presented well for the company, even as the low margin cutthroat competition from others like MF and Ash made that difficult. If Sweetwater looses even a little business from this, that's the way it should be.

Mr. Radke's letter above is no more or no less than I would expect from Sweetwater or any other corporation in a case like this. It's pretty much cover to mitigate any sales losses that might result from this. All the talk of "family" doesn't cut it on the face of it, because most "families" (except for maybe mob families) wouldn't fire a family member over something like this. Whatever I may have felt about Brad as a Sweetwater employee is irrelevant here, or maybe it makes my feelings even more relevant. He never owned an elevator...but he seems to have gotten the shaft.

-john


Brad Lyons
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 03:10 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

John,

Thanks John, that means a lot coming from you. I know we didn't mesh business-wise but have always respected your playing, your work, and you as a person.


havlicek
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 04:41 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Same here regarding you Brad. I have a VERY good friend of almost 30 years who got a similar deal from one of the major music retailers after decades of employment with the company. It was extraordinarily difficult for him, but he eventually landed on his feet. The situation in his case was nothing other than after all the time he was employed and the pay/benefits he accrued, the corporation began to see him as a liability. The same sorta thing happened with another friend of mine at the same retailer a few years later. Where being a loyal and productive employee would once get you a pension, a gold watch and some appreciation...it now represents greater risk of termination. That's a perverse situation, but not at all unusual. I wish you well Brad.

-john


Starliner
(Planeteer)
08/15/10 05:19 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Brad,
Good luck to you in the future, whatever path you may take.
Try to do what brings you the most pleasure...everything else is just B.S., regardless of the money involved.

Starliner


Tom Mix
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/15/10 05:53 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Very sorry to hear about this Brad. You are a good man and God is your provider so I'm not worried about your family. You are in good hands.

Arthur
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 12:51 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

I know we had our little stories, Brad, to put it in a mild understatement \:D
But I also know we put that behind us.
And I never forgot you were willing to get me into the SW chain to earn a living.
So if I may give you one single friendly advice: stop reacting on DUC and elswhere.
You have a lovely wife and kids to take care of. Do it the real american way, you have enough material in the forum posts to coutersue and have a comfi situation to check alternetives.
On a personal note, I am glad I left the shark pool called music bizz. It was and has killed me, my familiy and marriage.
If there is one thing I learned about you, is that you are a good salesman, a very good one at that - and I mean that in the most positive sense possible.
Now, even Jeff throws himself as your big menor, never forget he has only 1 loyalty.,, yep, his own career at SW.
So, don't invest energy in loyalty that is bound to be for the gutter, but invest in clever strategy and sue their pants off.
With the settlement money you can buy yourself time to look into other options. And that is precisely what I'd do: Leave the shark pool and keep your music for what it is supposed to be: passion in creativity.


flatcatAdministrator
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/16/10 02:35 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Sue? Why? To what end? They're not going to hire Brad back, nor would Brad want to go back there - because even if he were successful, they've made it clear they don't want him. Why would anyone go back into a situation where he is not wanted? He won't be successful - they won't allow that. They'll just look for a repeat performance. Or they'll make things so intolerable that he'll leave of his own accord.

Suing is pointless.

I don't have any idea who or what to believe about this situation. I'll just wish Brad good luck with his situation moving forward, and say that I'm still not interested in purchasing anything from Sweetwater.

BTW - the reason that corporations get to do this stuff is because of economies of scale. Mom and Pop stores are dying because frankly we don't want to pay the extra $50 or $100 or whatever to keep them open. We buy from Target, Wal-Mart, Guitard Center, and so on because we get more for our money. Of course it's a choice - and there are plenty of people who choose to buy from a local store - but let's face it, most people don't.


kid-surf
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 03:23 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Sue because the VP at Sweetwater did a pretty bang up job of making it really hard for Brad to find SUBSEQUENT work in his TRADE PROFESSION. It's very common to Google an applicant these days. I definitely think Brad may have a case. What that legal terminology is, I have no clue. But I suspect the VP crossed a line. They [Sweetwater] should have taken the position of "no comment" until the legal dept. drew something up [if the even felt the need to make a comment]...you know...making sure they were acting within the confines of legalities, civil or otherwise.

***When someone is fired in Hollywood the company's position is always "____ has decided to pursue other opportunities." THAT'S IT. The Sweetwater VP threw Brad under the bus and is apparently not a savvy enough wordsmith to decipher, within his own words, the ammunition he was teeing up for a lawyer. Fucking astounding!

IRONICALLY ----> the VP may end up being fired if Brad sues. I wouldn't feel so safe if I was Jeff Radke [his letter may cost Sweetwater some coin. Corporations don't dig on that. They don't mind casualties, obviously]. I definitely think Brad should seek council regardless [does he have a case or not?]. I'm not one for frivolous lawsuits but when you have a potential 'defamation of character' letter out there for the entire planet earth to see byway of a simple click of the mouse? That's called "fucking with someone's job opportunities for an unspecified length of time" [not the legal term, I realize]. That's not smart business, at all. In fact, I would be shocked if Brad dose not have a case.

Brad, DO NOT TYPE ANOTHER WORD ABOUT THIS!!! Be smart dude, this is no joke. Do not assume there are no repercussions for their "company statement". You surely feel a bit of guilt as your family's well being hangs in the balance...they were within their legal right to terminate you...BUT...I believe they took it one more step which may have now made them the ultimate bad guy, as determined by a court of law.

Sorry to hear the way this company is treating you after 10 years of towing the company line. Disgusting!


Memphis Monroe
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/16/10 04:03 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

 Quote:
Sue because the VP at Sweetwater did a pretty bang up job of making it really hard for Brad to find SUBSEQUENT work in his TRADE PROFESSION. It's very common to Google an applicant these days. I definitely think Brad may have a case. What that legal terminology is, I have no clue. But I suspect the VP crossed a line. They [Sweetwater] should have taken the position of "no comment" until the legal dept. drew something up [if the even felt the need to make a comment]...you know...making sure they were acting within the confines of legalities, civil or otherwise.

***When someone is fired in Hollywood the company's position is always "____ has decided to pursue other opportunities." THAT'S IT. The Sweetwater VP threw Brad under the bus and is apparently not a savvy enough wordsmith to decipher, within his own words, the ammunition he was teeing up for a lawyer. Fucking astounding!

IRONICALLY ----> the VP may end up being fired if Brad sues. I wouldn't feel so safe if I was Jeff Radke [his letter may cost Sweetwater some coin. Corporations don't dig on that. They don't mind casualties, obviously]. I definitely think Brad should seek council regardless [does he have a case or not?]. I'm not one for frivolous lawsuits but when you have a potential 'defamation of character' letter out there for the entire planet earth to see byway of a simple click of the mouse? That's called "fucking with someone's job opportunities for an unspecified length of time" [not the legal term, I realize]. That's not smart business, at all. In fact, I would be shocked if Brad dose not have a case.

Brad, DO NOT TYPE ANOTHER WORD ABOUT THIS!!! Be smart dude, this is no joke. Do not assume there are no repercussions for their "company statement". You surely feel a bit of guilt as your family's well being hangs in the balance...they were within their legal right to terminate you...BUT...I believe they took it one more step which may have now made them the ultimate bad guy, as determined by a court of law.

Sorry to hear the way this company is treating you after 10 years of towing the company line. Disgusting!
_________________________


Without knowing any of the details behind this unfortunate story, I think Jason makes a great point….Consider it.

Brad, I’m so sorry for the hardships you and your family are enduring right now. You really helped me out in the past, and that small gesture will NOT be forgotten. While you’re considering your options keep us posted, just to let us know everything is okay.

Peace, love, and happiness,

Chris


Doug C
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 05:14 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

That just plain sucks. So sorry Brad!

DAGtunes
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 06:50 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Good luck, Brad. Best wishes for whatever the future brings.

D.


ulank
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 07:21 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

 Originally Posted By: Popmann
You know...corporate is as corporate does. Tell me that immediate dismisal was the appropriate action for a long time employee who "leaked" something he shouldn't have? About another company, too, I might add. Not even about SW. So, they care SO much for getting future roadmap info that they would sacrifice one of their own?

Honestly...never really "got" Brad. Not one of my fave people hanging here...BUT...that's just wrong. Just another case of big INC sucking ass.

On the flip side of that...local store arranged for the local builder of an amp I like to come in and talk to me about prospective tweaks I'd like...and then lent me the amp for the weekend to record it and make sure it's "the one" for me. I'm sure that a big corporate store wouldn't do anything of the sort. And a corporate amp maker certainly wouldn't.

I wonder sometimes why we gravitate towards these huge corporations...yet complain to all hell about the lousy service...and their political donations (see recent Target faux pas)...and their big local tax breaks so they can underpay and mistreat our neighbors as employees. Not to mention that they homogenize America--making west Nashville just like some suburb 30 miles south of town...and neither one that different from whatever demographically similar parts of Florida or California or Iowa.

A guy locally building amps isn't going to subcontract to China, either...a big corporate entity will.

Sometimes I think the answer to getting America out of the "hell in a handbasket" fast track is simple--buy local. Publicly traded? F them. Obviously--it isn't always possible or beneficial...but, if we made that our default mode of spending our cash, would we not grow our own community and ultimately all enjoy our jobs a bit more?



Absolutely agree. While I don't think we can wholly detach ourselves from the "big box" stores (at least not at this point), it has always struck me as an odd disconnect...we will voice our displeasure with the business practices of these entities, yet not back that up with the most powerful voice we have in this matter - where we spend our dollars. And as consumers we often seek the lowest prices, while as employees, we want the best wages/benefits....somethings gotta give....

As noted, it's all but impossible to entirely avoid the big shops, but I do make it a point to seek out products and services from local, smaller, mom n pop shops if and whenever possible. I am routinely much more satisfied with the service and/or product I get from these folks. While I may not always get the "lowest" price per se, I feel my "bang for the buck" is much better going this route. Plus, I don't see the point in getting a low price when its often a piece of shit, cheap product.

I think anyone who does the vast majority of his/her shopping at WalMart, Meijers, Target, Home Depot, Lowes, etc. forfeits the right to bitch about "big corporate" as he/she is a direct contributor to the problem.



------------------

Don't really know ya, but sorry to hear about losing the gig, Brad.


Marty Gilman
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/16/10 07:31 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

The local mom & pop music stores have to special order everything I need, a real PITA. local corporate music stores have "kids that sell boxes."

Honestly, I think that Brad (or anyone) getting out of the music business is making the right choice these days. I am just glad I was able to make it through my entire career before the current state of the music business, where you couild make a living playing.

-m


MadGuitrst
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 07:50 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

to kid-surf.

Corporate Restructuring is what the VP should have said.
Hey, maybe Brad will be offered the VP job once he's fired......


Memphis Monroe
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/16/10 09:36 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

I don’t think the music business has died at all; I just think there’s been a paradigm shift. If you can get in on the ground floor of things to come then you could do incredibly well…..that’s what I’m looking to do as well.

As for mom and pop stores, those that have survived did so by adapting and realizing that they could not compete with the big box stores in terms of overhead and inventory. Again, it’s that paradigm shift. They had to rethink their business models, and some of them did by tapping into a market that was disenfranchised or simply not catered to by the big corporate box stores.

Remember there should be enough room in a healthy pond for big fish and little fish. If the big fish eat all the little fish eventually they’ll die too.....that's happening right now in the music retail business....Hence, the process starts all over again with those little fish who managed to lie low, stay below radar, and play it smart, keeping their businesses just big enough to profit but not so big that they were eating overhead costs thereby killing themselves.

Chris


String Jammer
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 10:04 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

I must say the I have done a lot of dealings with Brad, and he has been the most helpful, professional sales pro that I have ever dealt with. I'll miss him.

Randyman...
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 10:07 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

 Originally Posted By: kid-surf
Sorry to hear the way this company is treating you after 10 years of towing the company line. Disgusting!


I feel the same way. I'm sure there is more to the story - but this seems a bit too political for my liking. I called Sweetwater earlier and politely let a manager know that Brad was the only reason I EVER purchased anything from them (100% true as I only purchased from them after I became aquainted with Brad on this very forum!) - and I have no desire to make any future purchases due to this error in judgement. He worked tirelessly to promote Sweetwater - even on his own time "after hours" pimping the forums (to both his and Sweetwater's benefit) and did what a good salseman should do IMO. That approach is not everyone's cup of tea - but he was a good salesman in that regard IMNSHO.

His replacement has already hounded me for any gear needs (left a 2-3 MINUTE message on my machine blabbing on and on ) - that was something Brad never did because Brad knew my style - and was a "Personal" sales assistant.

I'm sure there's more to the big story (lots more) - but I still feel like this was more of a political agenda than a professional/business type deal (pressure from a manufacturer or similar)



Chimp
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 10:39 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Brad has always served me VERY WELL as well. Good luck Brad and jason does have a point.

glensimonds
(Planeteer)
08/16/10 10:43 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Brad is great no stress salesman and i can't beleive sweetwater
let him go, i doubt i will ever buy any thing else from sweetwater


String Jammer
(Planeteer)
08/17/10 12:42 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

I just received an order from AMS...I told Brad about it...it was only because they didn't have what I wanted, and the studio boom stand was $50 less at AMS. I spoke to Brad one day...the next day I got a phone call saying he was gone.

Brad Lyons
(Planeteer)
08/28/17 02:13 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Hey guys---LONG time no talk, eh? :-) And resurrecting an old thread. First of all, I hope everyone is doing well. It's been 7-years since I left Sweetwater. The truth is, I was probably about 6-12 months away from leaving for other ventures---they just sped the process up :-) I bet ya'll would like to know the details of what REALLY happened, huh? :-)

Doofie
(Planeteer)
08/28/17 04:07 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Like I said seven years ago, I'll wait till I read what Brad has to say.

So Brad, what do you have to say?


C Jo Go
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/28/17 04:31 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Hey BRAD -- those salesman at Sweetwater are still trying to sway me from my 90's gear ... AND Still no luck... ;\)

flatcatAdministrator
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/28/17 12:00 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Welcome back - glad the Planet is still orbiting so you can land and say hello.

Eric Collins
(Planeteer)
08/28/17 12:11 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Seven-year pregnant pause, eh? Well Brad sold me my 2480 as well as clueing me in on how necessary wall treatments are in a recording room, so he's okay by me!

Waterman
(Planeteer)
08/28/17 03:42 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Hey Brad!

Pete


Xenophile
(Planeteer)
08/28/17 04:10 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Since GAMBLE's gone, maybe I should say something caustic for old times' sake?

gonzo
(Loquacious Planeteer)
08/28/17 07:30 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater



Brad Lyons
(Planeteer)
08/30/17 12:51 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

LOL I was shocked to see this website was still around, and active, and this old post came up. I'll post the story later---I moved to Atlanta shortly after it all went down, I was fortunate that once news got out I had people from companies all over the country contacting me offering me a job on the spot. It turned out to be the best thing for me as so many doors have opened up. I primarily design large-scale sound/video/lighting systems for houses of worship and have been doing that pretty much since I left. Again, I'll post more later---but I wanted to say hello!

Xenophile
(Planeteer)
08/30/17 12:56 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Churches seem to have pretty impressive budgets for gear.
A friend of mine worked a big, pricey laser show for that church in Texas that has been in the news lately.


havlicek
(Planeteer)
08/30/17 10:59 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Sad news, and it's been a bad week. I just heard that Whitey Ford retired!

Eric Collins
(Planeteer)
08/30/17 11:46 AM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

 Originally Posted By: Brad Lyons
I primarily design large-scale sound/video/lighting systems for houses of worship and have been doing that pretty much since I left.


You know, I have a clear recollection of you telling us that...not sure how long ago. Glad to hear it has turned into a career that's sustained itself.


Brad Lyons
(Planeteer)
08/30/17 03:46 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Okay so here's the skinny.....

But first let me say that I spent 10-years there, I am very thankful for the opportunity they gave me to build my reputation and further expand that into the field. I enjoyed my time there, and now many years have gone on I just felt it was time to make some explanations :-) I still recommend you to buy from them, their service really is unlike anywhere else and the people (whether they are truly as experienced as they make you believe or not) really do care about their clients and making them happy. But I'm sure we ALL have stories about "what really goes on".


I had turned into a very big supporter of Pro Tools HD after the days of the PARIS system dying off. I became a fan of Digidesign and their Pro Tools line as well as their VENUE series of live consoles. In fact, I was one of those early on that said "DIGIDESIGN IN LIVE SOUND?? ARE YOU KIDDING??!?!". Well I got a preview of it and it clicked, this was indeed a real live console and NOT a Pro Tools system turned console. Up until that point, the involvement my former employer had in live sound was small speakers, small mixers, wireless systems, etc. IMHO, it was the DSHOW console that really started the ramp-up. I sold one of the very first DSHOW consoles in the country, the ironic thing is---we weren't even a dealer for it at that time :-) The console came in, so I called in the technical director at my church---the following week, we bought one as well as Pro Tools HD system with a Creation Station Rack PC (FYI they were anti PC until I came onboard and kept pushing---finally helping to develop a custom line of computers, known as the Creation Station). They were powerful computers, I even helped design and build a custom model for the Philadelphia Eagles for their production studios. Over time, models were updated and I wasn't really thrilled with how some of it was done, how they were built, etc. I started having major complications with my personal machines----I finally stopped and went MAC only, which eliminated every problem Had. I tried not to be vocal about it as much as possible, but it also didn't sit well with me listening to "talk" that wasn't accurate. This was amplified when I was "asked" "Do not be vocal about this, it looks bad". I was heavily involved in all kinds of production---Concert Production, Live TV, Church Broadcast for a very large TV ministry, Recording Projectors, Sound Design, Sound Analysis, and even doing some TV Post Production sub-contracting. I was knee deep in the field actually doing production work. I have sat through hundreds of manufacturer meetings in my life time where they all tell me "this is the best thing ever". Well I don't want that, I don't want slide shows, I don't want a spec sheet---I want to take it out in the field and use it. My clients ranged from JOHN MAYER to FOGHAT to LONESTAR to TURNER STUDIOS and WALT DISNEY.... to churches of all sizes, home studios, production studios of all sizes, and hobbyists alike. The reason my clients would gravitate towards me is they knew I gave them feedback based upon how the gear actually worked in the field under ME using it, not what I was told in a meeting or told to sell. If the product had issues, I brought it up. I created division between myself and others "here goes Brad again". Well the fact was I was doing this production work, and the vast majority of my colleagues were out of college of had very limited experience. Not to be rude, but most of those with home studios were just that--home studios, where mine was a fully working production studio doing real work and testing equipment in REAL WORLD SITUATIONS. So I held no apologies, because that was the time I was "allowed" to have manufacturer interaction. You see, I also came from one of the original music stores responsible for mail-order when I spent 4-years at Caruso Music in Connecticut. There I learned the old fashioned way of how things were done---how to spot fraud, how purchasing worked, discount structures, etc. I won't reveal exact details but I'll just say it this way.... There was a lot of stuff said and done behind the scenes that I knew better, and didn't agree with for a variety of reasons. And there were actions that were just flat out FALSE.... And I would call top management out on it, sometimes in meetings in front of the company as a way to get the attention that "this isn't right". So yes, I pushed buttons, I pushed boundaries, that's how I got things done and that's why my clients were so loyal to me. In fact my former colleagues would always joke "Brad if you ever leave can I have your clients".... :-)

I will go vocal about a meeting of how I was told the quantity of clients I'm working with is FAR below the company average, in fact by about 2/3rd's. I had the SMALLEST database of clients without question. But I told them "just let me do it my way and watch" and sure enough, that's where that line above came from. Management alike even said "I don't know how you do it. Well, I wrote the rules on it---LITERALLY, I formed a class to train new colleagues and old ones alike. Of course, the older colleagues with more seniority certainly didn't like that :-) They didn't like that comparisons were now being made. I had, on average, the LOWEST return rates---because I knew what I was talking about, I knew what worked and didn't and would NOT hold back to save someone's reputation. I had nearly double the gross profit per invoice than that of the company average. I would do more with less than most others did with far more. For me it wasn't about quantity, it was about quality. And it paid dividends for all..... BUT again, it made some enemies along the way.

SO FAST FORWARD..... Back to the Digiesign thing, who then became AVID. I was one that, reluctantly, people would come to for my input because they knew if there was a problem, I'd find all of them. This is how I was involved in the development of the VFIRE utility to get audio out of your VS2480 into a computer as one example. I was part of a private meeting that was so private, I apparently wasn't even supposed to mention I was part of this meeting at all. Obviously I knew I was under a verbal NDA (Non Disclosure Agreement) and have NEVER compromised NDA's....but this meeting was apparently an NDA, which to this day I NEVER recalled hearing that. Apparently, I was the only one. Well I was never given a form to sign, therefore it's hear-say. But supposedly, everyone else heard that the meeting was under NDA---I did not.

So I posted to the Digidesign User Group something along the lines of "hey guys, just had a private meeting with the folks of AVID to talk about what is coming. I know many, like myself, have been frustrated with the lack of information and updates about a lot of things. While I can't tell you what is coming, I can tell you to be on the lookout for some exciting announcements in the coming weeks. As a user myself, I'm very excited". So all I did was say "there will be news soon, so be patient". Well, that's what was the final straw. And in my opinion, they were looking for anything to make an example of me. And they did---and it blew up. As President Trump would say, BIGLY! :-) So back to that joke of "Brad if you ever leave.....". I didn't tell a single client of mine what had happened that Thursday afternoon around 4pm that I was terminated. But by the following morning I was getting personal emails from clients "hey Brad, I got a call from Josh who said you had left to pursue other interests and he was contacting me per your request" or another one was "Brad, I just got an email that you left the company but specifically told this new person to reach out to me". Word started getting around and hitting forum after forum, it was THE NEWS. It actually helped my spirits, that I had that many people out there concerned about it that they reached out and said "Brad, you're the best I've ever dealt with". I was notified of schools, churches, recording artists, and many other clients alike that said "I wanted you to know...".

This all went down on a Thursday afternoon, I went back in Friday to pickup some paperwork I needed and noticed one of the sales managers had his tie and shirt loosened, his air was a mess, and he looked completely exhausted. I learned through a few sources that weekend that there were an INSANE amount of calls (I'm told between 100-250) all morning, afternoon, and night long that Friday and even into the following week of former clients calling to give an earful. I had several still working there they took many of those calls, including asking to just be completely removed from all future mailings, etc. I started getting emails and phone calls from various Rep firms, Manufacturers, Retailers, etc from ALL over the country offering me a job on the spot by the time Monday rolled around---so I knew I was going to be okay. However at the same time, that news story had EXPLODED. But something else had happened.... management made a post about the situation, which actually kind of backfired pretty quick! From what I saw in 3-days time in posts and forums all over the industry I counted 250,000 views of threads and responses. Ironically enough, now you go back and some of those threads were deleted. Hmmmmm why is that one wonders??

So after this management post backfired, I get a call from "the boss" who I will always thank and hold regard for because again, he gave me that opportunity. I also know that he tried to fire me as he joked about a few times (I guess when you know too much.....). I get this phone call asking me to go public about what happened, that I knew I wasn't supposed to say anything, that I am 100% to blame and to "fan out the flames". He said "I will be fine, XXX will be fine...but think of your friends, think of your fellow co-workers". It hit me right there---- "I did nothing wrong and with all due respect, they were no longer my co-workers when YOU decided to fire me to make an example" and I hung up the phone. Ironically when I was fired I was told the CEO of AVID was absolutely FURIOUS over this and gave them no choice but to let me go or risk losing the line. I reached out to her---and ironically, she knew NOTHING about it. Not ONE thing. I reached out to a few others who said "it wasn't a big deal, as long as I didn't talk about what was going on--which you did not, so it's fine". It was the proof of what I had felt for so long.

But they did me a HUGE favor of firing me.... turns out there was an incredible world of wonderful things waiting for me, I just didn't know I needed to leave. And through it all I learned a lot about myself and others. I hold no ill will, even now---I'm just being honest about what transpired. It actually gave me a two month vacation as I transitioned to Atlanta to start a new venture down here. :-) MORE on that to come....


grachus
(Planeteer)
08/30/17 11:14 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

I just want to say sorry to hear of the job there brad im in the same boat in my job
I go back on Tuesday after a holiday of two weeks to get into a pissing match with management and my union over what to do to me now that I failed a personal improvement plan PIP so management want s to fire my ass
Union says no I don't think so
Algorithm measurements suck especially if not applied across all employees
Anywho
About the idea of bottom line
My kids 18 years of age really buy that idea about everything except for what they want
Best computer please..best phone...but if I tip a taxi driver they are at me why would you give that guy 4 bucks tip???
Damn hello nice human
Brad is a smart guy I'm sure hell find the next job


Waterman
(Planeteer)
08/31/17 03:28 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

What a story Brad. Seems like there's a book or movie in there somewhere?

Pete


Brad Lyons
(Planeteer)
09/03/17 04:58 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

Waterman, Well if I were to tell you about my EX-WIFE and that situation---there's (2) whole seasons of Jerry Springer Episodes there! :-)

Arthur
(Planeteer)
09/03/17 06:50 PM
Re: Brad's left Sweetwater

You had one like that as well? \:\)