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#1022060 - 01/11/11 04:37 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: BrianJ]
Rickbell7 Offline
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As long as the 2480 uses a standard IDE notebook type hard drive, this setup should work.
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#1022090 - 01/11/11 08:52 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: BrianJ]
cortson Offline
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Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 21
I tried hooking up the SD conversion using a PNY 4GB SDHC in my VS880EX. It did NOT recognize the drive. It also did not recognize a SanDisk 4GB. I'll see if I can find a Lexar. Never give up.
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#1022098 - 01/11/11 10:01 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: cortson]
cortson Offline
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Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 21
I went a got the Lexar 4GB and still "NoDrv".
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#1022103 - 01/11/11 10:22 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: cortson]
cortson Offline
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Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 21
Got the cable oriented right and........... Success!
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#1022117 - 01/11/11 11:22 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: cortson]
cortson Offline
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Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 21
Updated both vs880EX and vs880! 24 tracks on SD which I can load to the PC and convert with the WAV converter for mixing later. Also by far easier for storage and copying.
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#1022198 - 01/11/11 03:25 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: cortson]
cortson Offline
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Registered: 11/04/10
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As mounting, I gently folded the ribbon cable under the unit and put the drive cover over it. This left the circuit card outside. I put a 2 inch strip of tape on the bottom so there would be no contact between the card and the case. After some thinking I came upon a small squeeze frame coin purse. I picked up 3 leather ones at the local dime store for a buck a piece. I pinched open the purse and slipped it over the circuit card. It lays flat against the bottom and out of the way. I can slip the purse off when I want access to the SD card.
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#1022432 - 01/12/11 01:24 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: cortson]
Rickbell7 Offline
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Registered: 10/30/10
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Loc: Upper Midwestern US
@Cortson:
Glad to hear that things worked out for you. Was a bit worried for a moment. Unfortunately, these cards and cables are not well marked or keyed for proper installation.
As to the SanDisk cards, nobody I know has ever gotten one of those to work in a VS unit. Almost any other brand of card will work. Currently, the PNY and Lexar cards seem to work best.
Great ideas for mounting the card reader. Sounds like the best compromise. It is important to assure that there is no contact between the reader and any metal in the case.

Thanks for your insight.:)
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#1023217 - 01/15/11 05:06 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: Rickbell7]
zpluug Offline
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Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
 Originally Posted By: Rickbell7
No. The PC doesn't recognize the file type.

I understand there are some programs out there that will convert the files for use in the PC. But I haven't tried any of those yet.

Hi,

If you haven't found those yet you can download the apps "Cd2Roland.exe" and "VS Wave Export.exe" from this page the first app rips the Roland format files from the backup CD into your PC when you can use the second app to convert the Roland format files into WAVs, a single file for each track.

Z

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#1023227 - 01/15/11 06:30 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: zpluug]
Rickbell7 Offline
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Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 97
Loc: Upper Midwestern US
This sounds like exactly what people have been looking for.
I'll check these app's out when I have some time.

Thanks!
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Rick - NJP Productions

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#1023394 - 01/16/11 06:13 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: Rickbell7]
cortson Offline
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Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 21
As you know I converted my 3 VS 880 (2 are EX) to SD card storage. I did a test recording and saved the tracks to the SD card. I then took the SD card and plugged it into my PC. I used the VS Wave Export.exe. The program exported all of the tracks and they were all stored on my PC as wav files. I opened up Reaper and added the media files to separate tracks when Reaper asked if that is what I'd like, and whammo! it worked!
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#1023436 - 01/16/11 11:36 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: cortson]
Rickbell7 Offline
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Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 97
Loc: Upper Midwestern US
@cortson :

That's great! Sounds like this is turning into a BIG success story. A bit of a rough start for you at first, but I'm glad to see that you have it all pretty much sorted now. Well done!
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#1024043 - 01/20/11 02:22 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: BrianJ]
DAGtunes Offline
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Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 7588
Loc: San Clemente, CA
Excellent job, RickBell7! Nice video, too.

I still have my VS880EX in storage, though I've moved on to the VS2480.

This may motivate me to bring her back out, as a field recorder or something...hmmm.

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#1024192 - 01/20/11 08:36 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: will_f]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
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 Originally Posted By: will_f
...I have the SD card reader inside the unit for now. For those users who have extended the card reader outside of the unit with a ribbon cable, what are you using to protect the card reader?


Quite a while back, someone else also did a conversion similar to this..... maybe it was Bear, IIRC...

The pics are no longer around as far as I know, but the solution was a very clever one.
They had someone build a small frame to position the card reader slot inside the drive bay and then cut an opening into the front cover plate that usually hides the drive bay opening. You could then simply slide the card in and out of the slot like you would on a PC.... At least that's how I remember the pictures and description.

Great news about the continuing success of this kind of adaptation. Makes me want to get busy and convert both my 880 and 1680. It would be especially nice now that I have at least one PC with a card reader installed (no need for an external reader like I would have needed in the past) that will allow me to import my tracks to the PC daw.
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#1024503 - 01/22/11 01:56 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: uptildawn]
zpluug Offline
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Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
 Originally Posted By: uptildawn

They had someone build a small frame to position the card reader slot inside the drive bay and then cut an opening into the front cover plate that usually hides the drive bay opening. You could then simply slide the card in and out of the slot like you would on a PC.... At least that's how I remember the pictures and description.

Great news about the continuing success of this kind of adaptation. Makes me want to get busy and convert both my 880 and 1680. It would be especially nice now that I have at least one PC with a card reader installed (no need for an external reader like I would have needed in the past) that will allow me to import my tracks to the PC daw.

How about a floppy drive style internal ide card reader for the VS? Will it fit?

I did this search and the pics look like something might just fit into the VS HDD caddy. Anyone ever tried one?

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#1024512 - 01/22/11 03:12 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: uptildawn]
zpluug Offline
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Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
 Originally Posted By: uptildawn
The pics are no longer around as far as I know, but the solution was a very clever one.

I think this was the device they had used. I'll check the website to see whether there's a similar adapter for SD cards.

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#1024513 - 01/22/11 03:14 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: zpluug]
Rickbell7 Offline
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Might take some "creative modifications" to make it fit the tracks in the drive bay. But if you have a Dremel tool and some patience, some of these could work quite well.

Make sure you get one with the proper interfase connector though. It needs to be a notebook type IDE 44 pin connector.
SATA, USB and 40 Pin IDE(hard drive)connectors will not work in this application.
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#1024517 - 01/22/11 03:31 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: Rickbell7]
zpluug Offline
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Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
 Originally Posted By: Rickbell7
Might take some "creative modifications" to make it fit the tracks in the drive bay. But if you have a Dremel tool and some patience, some of these could work quite well.

Make sure you get one with the proper interfase connector though. It needs to be a notebook type IDE 44 pin connector.
SATA, USB and 40 Pin IDE(hard drive)connectors will not work in this application.

Can this be it?

I don't know whether I can get one where I live but I'll certainly check it out once I can get my hands on one.

As you can see, the back is open. I think you could do some diy to either fit this into the Roland HD bay or make something like the back plate of the caddy to hold the Roland connector, out of hard plastic or tin and attach it to the back of this thing.

The ribbon might cause some problem though. It doesn't seem you could just cram the shortest ribbon available in the small room that remains between this device's connector to the Roland's. There might be people in electronics shops who could shorten these ribbons to your specifications I guess.

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#1024520 - 01/22/11 03:39 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: Rickbell7]
zpluug Offline
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Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
It says it's 40 pin. Damn!

Wait, I don't know why a converter like this one couldn't work.

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#1024522 - 01/22/11 03:46 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: zpluug]
zpluug Offline
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Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
To be clear: the Addonics CF adapter is 44 pin, but their multi card reader is 40 pin. I guess the abovementioned 40 pin to 44 pin adapter ($4) would do the job. Now I'm curious whether you could have the VS recognize any type of cards that the reader can accept, this would be heaven!
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#1024530 - 01/22/11 04:10 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: zpluug]
zpluug Offline
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Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
The card reader has a floppy power connector. I think it's for the LED and won't pose a problem. Here's a 40-Pin to 44-Pin 2.5 IDE cable adapter.
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#1024543 - 01/22/11 05:22 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: zpluug]
gabeNC Offline
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Registered: 01/22/11
Posts: 6
Long time listener, first time caller.

I've had the 880ex for about 4 years or so. One of the most frustrating things was the amount of hassle to transfer tracks. First of all thanks Rick for a great video. And thanks to Danielo for the wave exporter (plus the ripper by bear). Because of this thread, I've fallen in love with this complex, ancient, archaic piece of hardware all over again.

It's amazing how quiet the box is now, a pair of 4GB SD cards was $15!!! Ten clams for the adapter... how can you beat that? So thanks guys, keep up the good work.

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#1024556 - 01/22/11 07:00 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: zpluug]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8771
Loc: on land
 Originally Posted By: zpluug
 Originally Posted By: uptildawn
The pics are no longer around as far as I know, but the solution was a very clever one.

I think this was the device they had used. I'll check the website to see whether there's a similar adapter for SD cards.

I believe you may be correct.... it IS CF only though, isn't it.... I believe it was the single slot adapter as well, because they/he did not make a slot big enough for more than one layer of card to be inserted through the caddy cover.
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#1024557 - 01/22/11 07:25 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: zpluug]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8771
Loc: on land
 Originally Posted By: zpluug
The card reader has a floppy power connector. I think it's for the LED and won't pose a problem. Here's a 40-Pin to 44-Pin 2.5 IDE cable adapter.


Don't know where you're going with all these adapters, but from what I've seen in my own modifications, all these things you're tacking on are much too bulky to fit INSIDE the drive bay.... maybe not....... but it looks like too much bulk.

I'm thinking that using the existing drive caddy that fits around the ide drive can save a lot of mounting fabrication problems, especially when it comes to how to use the existing drive adapter from the caddy. I'm thinking you could use the card reader mentioned here with a short ribbon cable, all mounted inside the framework of the ide drive caddy:

QOUTE: "The adapter you point to in the link is exactly what you need. BUT!!! I would order it from this seller: http://cgi.ebay.com/SD-SDHC-MMC-TO-2-5-4...047618433981988 This one is the same unit, but in the USA, and has free shipping." END QUOTE...

_____________________

I'm thinking that with a 2" cable it'd be a little short still..... It's only 1.75" long (front to back). It's a bit short width-wise, but it could probably be mounted inside a drive caddy (removing the one from your ide drive and using it would work) with some brackets. Maybe the 6" cable would work folded up on itself to extend the card reader out to the caddy cover plate.

Actually, I'm thinking to do away with the ribbon cable entirely, connect the card reader directly to the Roland hard drive adapter, mounted in the caddy and then simply slide the caddy into place as I always have with my spare hard drives. Taking the caddy out to change SD cards would be painless if it can be mounted properly within the drive caddy boundaries.

I've got some parts ordered and will see how it goes together next week sometime. I'll keep y'all posted on this.


Edited by uptildawn (01/22/11 07:27 PM)
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#1024821 - 01/24/11 04:08 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: uptildawn]
zpluug Offline
Space Cadet


Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
 Originally Posted By: uptildawn
 Originally Posted By: zpluug
The card reader has a floppy power connector. I think it's for the LED and won't pose a problem. Here's a 40-Pin to 44-Pin 2.5 IDE cable adapter.


Don't know where you're going with all these adapters, but from what I've seen in my own modifications, all these things you're tacking on are much too bulky to fit INSIDE the drive bay.... maybe not....... but it looks like too much bulk.

I'm thinking that using the existing drive caddy that fits around the ide drive can save a lot of mounting fabrication problems, especially when it comes to how to use the existing drive adapter from the caddy. I'm thinking you could use the card reader mentioned here with a short ribbon cable, all mounted inside the framework of the ide drive caddy:

QOUTE: "The adapter you point to in the link is exactly what you need. BUT!!! I would order it from this seller: http://cgi.ebay.com/SD-SDHC-MMC-TO-2-5-4...047618433981988 This one is the same unit, but in the USA, and has free shipping." END QUOTE...

_____________________

I'm thinking that with a 2" cable it'd be a little short still..... It's only 1.75" long (front to back). It's a bit short width-wise, but it could probably be mounted inside a drive caddy (removing the one from your ide drive and using it would work) with some brackets. Maybe the 6" cable would work folded up on itself to extend the card reader out to the caddy cover plate.

Actually, I'm thinking to do away with the ribbon cable entirely, connect the card reader directly to the Roland hard drive adapter, mounted in the caddy and then simply slide the caddy into place as I always have with my spare hard drives. Taking the caddy out to change SD cards would be painless if it can be mounted properly within the drive caddy boundaries.

I've got some parts ordered and will see how it goes together next week sometime. I'll keep y'all posted on this.

Hope the parts work.

I was just searching the web to see what could fit. I have pointed out the worries you mention in the posts. I also said the adapter cable was too long and I thought it wouldn't be possible to cram it in the device.

I'm looking for a 4" (W) card reader, with a depth similar or less than that of the Roland caddy. The Addonics card reader's depth is 5.5".

I haven't taken out the drive in my VS-880 EX yet, I'll only do it when I have the parts, however, In Rick's video it seems the caddy is longer than 5.5" (i.e. the card reader) so, width and depth-wise the reader can easily fit in the VS. That you found a short adapter cable, we have no more worries in that department either. The "only" remaining problem is the Roland connector.

This drives us towards using the Roland caddy instead but here again we have to prepare something that will function as the surface under the caddy that will hold the CF adpter.

I don't think this is easier. If we can find a reader with the exact depth of the Roland caddy, we can cut something out of tin or hard plastic in the shape of the back of the caddy -or if we are sure of ourselves, cut the Roland caddy's back and attach it to the reader- to fit the Roland connector.

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#1024822 - 01/24/11 04:40 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: gabeNC]
zpluug Offline
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Registered: 01/08/05
Posts: 24
 Originally Posted By: gabeNC


One of the most frustrating things was the amount of hassle to transfer tracks.

Because of this thread, I've fallen in love with this complex, ancient, archaic piece of hardware all over again.

Talking about frustrating! The companies went as far as creating amazing machines like Roland VS-2480, AKAI DPS-24 and Korg D32XD and once Tascam brought out their 2488 for about $800, suddenly every music gear company betrayed those who impatiently waited for the VS-2480 that could actually play back 24 tracks @24 bit (linear) with PC audio interface capability, all of them started the rat race towards making handheld TWO track recorders, some also with PC audio interface.

Today, Zoom makes an R24 multitrack recorder using SD/SDHC (up to 32 GB) that plays back 24 tracks at up to 24 bit/48 KHz which also doubles as a 24/96 PC interface with 8 XLR/TRS combi inputs, 6 of which can provide phantom power, also a couple of built-in condensers, USB host, to download the tracks on a USB flash drive besides the USB for the interface... all for $500.

All this is great, but the machine doesn't even have a footswitch jack, has no digital I/O, no MIDI, etc., etc. Yet software-wise it is stupefying how they have left out almost any possibility of track editing, soloing a channel, just one level of undo/redo (our VSs have 999 undo, however only one redo but that is not that bad), horrible input to track assignment (you have to swap the recorded track with an empty track to have it record, say, your guitar that's plugged into the Hi-Z input), etc.

Roland puts out a BR-800 which doesn't even do more than 6 track playback, no 24 bit and no serious track editing. Tascam with their DPs also don't do a better job. Korg, AKAI and Yamaha have altogether given up the standalone multitracker idea. Fostex is trying to get the lowest end of the market and puts out garbage.

Frustrated or what? Hey, dear music gear companies, hey dear Roland, if you still believe there are people who can't let go of the standalone multitrackers to lay down their tracks away from the PC (proof: the Zoom R16/24/8, Tascam DP-02/DP-03, etc., Boss BRs) to add the final touches using software DAW, then please add some DECENT features to your products and do not think people won't pay a couple hundred dollars more.

For Christ's sake my first VS-880 cost me $2700 in 1996 and believe me, I'm far from being rich, otherwise I'd be busy using my Avalons, Digidesign desks, Neumann mics and I don't know what, and I wouldn't bother writing on these boards ;\)

In the end I'd like to point out that I absolutely LOVE the logic of Roland gear and using my VS-880 EX presents no complexity for me. I have used every single feature of the machine and find it all totally intuitive once you learn to get around.

I remember, however, the first VS-880 had two recording modes, it was confusing and illogical so, they dropped it in the EX, adding a couple dozen useful features (hardware and software) that made me switch to the latter. The only step backwards is you can't use the 3 band EQ on the same input AND track, which could be done on the old VS-880.

That's why I would like to see new products having AT LEAST all the possibilities of our "ancient, complex, archaic" VSs. Give me a VS-890 (or a VS-1824) with a USB PC audio interface that records on SD/SDHC/(and why not, SDXC ready) and I won't look any further.

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#1024911 - 01/24/11 11:21 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: cortson]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8771
Loc: on land
 Originally Posted By: cortson
As you know I converted my 3 VS 880 (2 are EX) to SD card storage. I did a test recording and saved the tracks to the SD card. I then took the SD card and plugged it into my PC. I used the VS Wave Export.exe. The program exported all of the tracks and they were all stored on my PC as wav files. I opened up Reaper and added the media files to separate tracks when Reaper asked if that is what I'd like, and whammo! it worked!


Say, if you're still following this thread....
Have you had repeated success with recording tracks to the SD card and then transfering them to the PC via VSWE?

I'm trying this out for the first time tonight and I'm only having spotty success with the tracks showing up in VSWE.
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#1024914 - 01/25/11 12:31 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: uptildawn]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
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Well, how 'bout that! I got the card adapter and the card in the mail today.... only took the weekend to get it to me!

I've had a couple successes and a couple disappointments.

1- The IDE to SD adapter is very small... plugs right in to the Roland 40-44pin adapter in the caddy.... fits snuggly too, but I might want to secure it a little bit better if I were to take the SD card in and out of the slot very often because the card, itself, fits very tightly into the holder on the SD adapter board.

2- The card holder is oriented sideways to the front of the caddy.... no surprize, but a little inconvenient the way I currently have things situated.

3- One of my VS drives has a steel caddy (not plastic) and the 40-44 pin adapter is actually screwed against the caddy... not just dropped freely into a slot as the plastic caddy is made. This is the caddy I've chosen to use for the time being because I've plugged the SD adapter directly into the 40-44 pin adapter... not used a ribbon cable. The SD card has just barely enough room to slip into and out of the card holder... the wall of the caddy is very close to the card holder opening.... much better had it been mounted the length-wise direction, 'cause there's certainly plenty of room that way.

4- I'm trying this with a 4GB PNY Optima SDHC card (like one in the list, I think) and using the 1680 for testing.

5- The SD card initializes and formats perfectly to its 2GB partition size limits (total of 2 X 2GB for the 1680).... especially when you have the card plugged in the holder completely. \:\) It also formats and runs perfectly on an IBM Thinkpad X60 with XP/SP-3... for what that's worth.

6- I tested the card in the 1680 with a few different tasks... recorded 8 tracks at once for 60 seconds to see how the card handled the data needs.... then I kept those 8 tracks and recorded another set of 8 tracks alonside to increase the load. Both record of the second 8 tracks and playback of the entire 16 tracks seemed to be okay (I recorded blank inputs, so nothing to play back audibly), except that I noticed the time display would suddenly slow almost to a halt every 8-10 seconds and then quickly start up again... maybe indicative a slow data transfer speeds? But I got no drive busy messages...

7- Here's the part that got my goat at the moment... When using VSWE to extract the tracks from the SD card in the PC, I kept getting an error list that indicated that some track data was being "ignored".... In fact, only part of the tracks would show up in the track list matrix every time I tried a test (4 tests tonight in all).... Say, in a test of 4 tracks, I might only get three of them to show up and convert to .wav files. Although those .wav files appeared to play back normally, there was one or two that appeared to have slight problems in the wave graphic (using Sound Forge to view the files).... possibly in the playback itself... I was improvising some nonsense on the guitar, so I was guessing sometimes as to what should actually be on the complete track, but it seemed obvious the two places that I noticed slight problems.

8- I'm really tired, so that's all she wrote tonight, but I've got some time tomorrow to dig deeper. I ordered at least two of everything (so that I can adapt both VS units eventually). Maybe I'll try another card and adapter tomorrow as well. I'm also going to experiment a tiny bit with other mounting options.

9- I've got to add that I have no problem at all leaving the card adapter plugged directly into the caddy and 40-44 pin adapter. I'm accustomed to leaving the caddy cover plate off the machine and routinely swap a hard drive (in its own caddy) now and then, so removing the SD adapter mounted in a caddy to access the SD card is no big deal. The biggest pain is removing the card because it fits very snuggly in the holder and the holder is mount nearly flush to the circuit board, so not much room for fingers to pull the card out and there's no spring release.

Anyway.... it's a start. Looking forward to more results tomorrow.

6-
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#1024928 - 01/25/11 03:36 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: uptildawn]
Rickbell7 Offline
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Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 97
Loc: Upper Midwestern US
 Originally Posted By: uptildawn
The biggest pain is removing the card because it fits very snuggly in the holder and the holder is mount nearly flush to the circuit board, so not much room for fingers to pull the card out and there's no spring release.



That is my one issue with the unit as well. I have big, clumsy, fingers (as you can see in the videos, LOL) and I am always afraid I might grab the adapter the wrong way and break something. And yes, it really does hold that SD card tightly.


BTW, congratulations on the new adapter and some of the success you have had with it already. I haven't had time to experiment with transfering tracke to the PC yet, so any info I read about it is quite helpful. Thanks!


Also kudos to the other contributers to this thread. There are some really GREAT posts here! Thanks everyone!
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Rick - NJP Productions

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#1024929 - 01/25/11 03:46 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: gabeNC]
Rickbell7 Offline
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Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 97
Loc: Upper Midwestern US
 Originally Posted By: gabeNC
Long time listener, first time caller.

I've had the 880ex for about 4 years or so. One of the most frustrating things was the amount of hassle to transfer tracks. First of all thanks Rick for a great video. And thanks to Danielo for the wave exporter (plus the ripper by bear). Because of this thread, I've fallen in love with this complex, ancient, archaic piece of hardware all over again.

It's amazing how quiet the box is now, a pair of 4GB SD cards was $15!!! Ten clams for the adapter... how can you beat that? So thanks guys, keep up the good work.



@gabeNC ..LOL @ "First time caller" good one:)

Welcome! Nice to have you here. Glad the video helped. Sounds like another success story here. Indeed, the quiet-ness of it was what amazed me. I was so used to hearing that HD in there happily spinning away. Now...silence!
You got a great deal...and for less that 30 USD, you are on the way again. Congratulations!:)
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Rick - NJP Productions

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#1024936 - 01/25/11 08:58 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: Rickbell7]
SteveDWalker Offline
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Posts: 3036
Loc: Clearwater
Since I have the VS-2480HD, I checked into the "40-pins IDE to SD Adapter" on ebay at http://cgi.ebay.com/3-5-SD-SDHC-MMC-40-P...=item19c10a9891

I found that this adapter will fit perfectly inside my 2480 HD caddy. The caddy can be modified to provide an opening at the front to insert the SD card.

Also, with the HD recorder, I can switch between using the hard disk caddy's and a SD caddy.

It appears that other users on the VS Planet recommend using the Lexar 32GB 133X 20MB/sec Class 10 SD card. The 2480 routinely creates three 10GB partitions on a 30GB hard drive. You could also use a less expensive $59.00 16GB 133x SD card to cover one project. I think Bear estimates the 133x speed may be the minimum required, does anyone else have information about the speed required for the SD card?

Assuming the SD card will work in the VS-2480, in addition to the advantages already mentioned, I think the two most important advantages to using the SD card are:

1. Backing up 2480 projects by inserting the SD card into my laptop and storing it to my 2 TB hard drive.

2. Transfering the contents of the SD card to my laptop hard drive, then using VS Wave Export to extract up to 24 tracks to wave files.
_________________________
Steve

Roland V-Studio 100, Sonar Platinum, VS-2480HD, M-Audio, Korg,Alesis, Audix, Shure, Mackie, JBL, EV, Taylor, Gibson, Ovation, Ephiphone, Ibanez, Fender, Sunn 2000S

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#1024948 - 01/25/11 11:10 AM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: SteveDWalker]
uptildawn Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8771
Loc: on land
I don't generally like dual posts in multiple forums (for myself, it's a pain), but figured I'd post my comments to Steve's post above, since he was kind enough to post his findings in both the 2480 and this forum:

Originally Posted By: SteveDWalker...It appears that other users on the VS Planet recommend using the Lexar 32GB 133X 20MB/sec Class 10 SD card. The 2480 routinely creates three 10GB partitions on a 30GB hard drive. You could also use a less expensive $59.00 16GB 133x SD card to cover one project. I think Bear estimates the 133x speed may be the minimum required, does anyone else have information about the speed required for the SD card?... END QUOTE

This is interesting to me and something I hadn't considered completely before getting the SD card I am now testing.
The PNY Optima 4GB SDHC card packaging does not list and I don't recall seeing the mention of a 133x spec, or any such thing... guess I'll have to dig deeper into the listing and see if I missed that.

This Optima is a Class 4, with a minimum of 4MB/sec..... I assumed this would be enough for the fewer input and track channels I have to work with in the 1680 and the 880. Maybe I need to consider getting more robust cards for the 1680 and these might be fine for the 880. I was looking primarily at the size of the card, deciding that I didn't need to spend the extra money for more GB if I'm restricted to 2GB partition limits (the 1680 max) and the main purpose is to move tracks to the PC DAW... which it is for me at this time.

If you happen to have a link to the type of SD card recommended, I'd appreciate your posting it...... might save a little bit of digging for somebody else down the road.

___________________

Also, a couple of reasons I was set on the smaller 4GB size card have to do with limitations of VSWE and Windows to "see" more than 4 partitions (if memory serves) on a drive and the minimum published access speed of 13ms by Roland for their 880 and 1680 hard drives... I assumed that the 4GB PNY cards I bought would fill that requirement, but looking at PNY's own website, I don't find the access speed listed for these cards.

I'm now inclined to get a couple of their newer class 10 drives, which happen to be on sale (the 8GB) right now http://www.amazon.com/PNY-Professional-H...41&sr=8-3-fkmr1

I'll post back when I get more results..... hopefully later today.


Edited by uptildawn (01/25/11 11:33 AM)
_________________________
uptildawn

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#1024958 - 01/25/11 01:14 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: uptildawn]
Rickbell7 Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 97
Loc: Upper Midwestern US
I can't speak for the larger units like the 1680 or 2480, since my experience is only with the 880 (notthe EX).

From my experience so far, I have found that a class 4 SD card is a minimum for the VS880.
I had an older class 2 card that I tried one time just as a test. It worked fine until I had more than three tracks and tried an overdub. The display siad "Drive Too Slow" and the 880 crashed.
I did the same test with a class 4 card and there was no problem. I have not yet tried a class 4 with more than 5-6 tracks, but I think it would handle a full 8 track mix.

I don't have a class 6 SD card at the moment, but I would think that it should work fine. The limiting factor as far as speed in that case would be the adapter itself. If you have a slower adapter, it won't matter how fast the SD card is. But if your adapter is SDHC compatible, then speed shouldn't be much of an issue.

One more thing to keep in mind about the VS880 is that it has a maximum drive capacity of 4gig. The largest partition it can work with is 1gig. You can use larger capacity in there, but the unit will only "see" and use 4gig's. I don't know of any way around that limit since it is in the VS880's operating system.
_________________________
Rick - NJP Productions

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#1024972 - 01/25/11 02:21 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: Rickbell7]
uptildawn Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8771
Loc: on land
Partition limits with all the pre-2480 series are governed by the design of the unit and can't be over-ridden, to my knowledge (which is fair to say would be minimal in this respect). The 1680/1880 can utilize up to 16GB with 2GB partition limits.

Here's another update:

I've been reading up some on the whole speed thing, but I come away with very little useful figures for comparing the different cards. X-speeds appear to be read speeds, Mbit/s appear to be write speeds... niether of which is clearly stated as to the card's minimum vs. maximum speed quoted. The class 10 cards appear to have the most consistently stated specs in the published sale descriptions... Class 4 cards often lacking enough info to get a handle on their spec ratings...

Class 6 seem like an alternative that would work for the lower track counts of the 880 series and possibly the 1680/1880. I'm about to compare all three here in a little while, since I broke down and bought a classe 6 and class 10 at a local store instead of waiting for online shipping.

I'll post more as I find out.
_________________________
uptildawn

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#1024998 - 01/25/11 05:48 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: uptildawn]
uptildawn Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8771
Loc: on land
Been discovering a few things about transfering these song files to the PC...

I considered posting the string of posts I found while searching for info today, many of which I was an active participant even...
There's just too many relevant posts to bother with that at the moment, but I did find out something that shed some light on one issue I am having.

1- Evidently, bear discovered way back that songs copied/recorded to an SD card (his was CF) hooked up to the ide connector are not in a format that the PC can deal with to the point where you can't access the VS song file that's needed to import into Reaper, for instance. Only tracks copied/recorded to an SD card hooked up to the scsi port are written by the VS in a way that the PC can understand enough to import VS songs into Reaper.

I knew that at one point in time, but haven't touched this subject since then.

2- Even after buying a class 10 SDHC card and testing extraction of tracks in the PC via VSWE, I was not initially able to extract all the tracks I recorded... many would show up in an error message that said they were "ignored".... bummer, right?

Well, since they showed up and played fine in the VS, I decided that they must not be written completely to the SD card when I first try swapping it out to the PC.

After putting the SD card back in the VS and just simply letting it run for ten or twenty minutes (I have no clue as to whether it needs to actually run in play mode, or what length of time is needed at this point), I discovered that all the tracks do eventually show up in VSWE and I can extract them into .wav files. These can then be imported into any DAW for editing.

Don't know why this works the way it does, but it's something to ponder.

I know I've been doing this with a 1680 and that the problems I'm experiencing may not be relevant to the 880 users, but the transfering of tracks to the PC is what matters to both of us, at least part of the goal with using this adaptation.

I'll post more later, after some more testing... maybe with the VS880.

_______

Oh yeah!

Also, recording 8 tracks at one time, especially while playing back as few as four other tracks (as in an overdub session) causes the time display to pause briefly every few seconds as I described before. Playing back as many as eight tracks causes no such delayed reaction.... This is while using the class 10 SDHC card. So, it appears that even the class 10 SD card is not capable of performing write and read tasks simultaneously with the same proficiency as the typical IDE drive (with the reccommended 13ms or better seek time) we're all using today. At least not these PNY SD cards.
_________________________
uptildawn

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#1025011 - 01/25/11 07:17 PM Re: SD Adaptor for the VS880!! - And it works great! [Re: uptildawn]
gabeNC Offline
Space Cadet


Registered: 01/22/11
Posts: 6
FWIW, got a little corruption on the SD card when running in linux (fedora 13). I dual boot my laptop and by default linux is primary, it saw the SD card and mounted all four partitions... so far so good.

So I umount and reboot into windows, VSWE can't read the card and when I drop it back into the 880ex it doesn't like it and have to re-init the drive. I'll try to recreate the problem and see if something is getting modified in the FAT table. *shrug*

Good thing I didn't have any tracks on there worth keeping. Anybody else see anything like that?

thanks.

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