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#1423131 - 10/08/15 12:32 PM RBUS cable wanted
canefire Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 11/02/04
Posts: 619
Loc: Silver Spring , MD USA
Hi All,
I just got a Roland XV5080 and I want to connect it to my VS2480. I was hoping that these cables were plentiful but I do not see one on my local craigslist or ebay.
Next stop is the Roland website. Are they easy to obtain?
Cheers,
Ian
_________________________
"A Cobra never wastes its venom on dead and fleeing things" - The Mantra of the Cobra

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#1423251 - 10/08/15 05:58 PM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: canefire]
bear Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 6225
Loc: abq,nm,usa
Pretty hard to find these days...

Easy to make

http://www.vsplanet.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1196464

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#1423252 - 10/08/15 06:00 PM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: bear]
bear Offline
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Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 6225
Loc: abq,nm,usa

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#1423337 - 10/09/15 08:47 AM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: bear]
canefire Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 11/02/04
Posts: 619
Loc: Silver Spring , MD USA
Thanks,
_________________________
"A Cobra never wastes its venom on dead and fleeing things" - The Mantra of the Cobra

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#1425420 - 10/19/15 07:42 PM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: canefire]
Slabraton Offline
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Registered: 12/16/12
Posts: 11791
Loc: California
For what it's worth, the proprietary RBUS cable is what turned me against Roland. Changing a couple of pins around to force consumers (who've already shelled out hundreds of dollars) is JIVE.

That, plus the lack of support from Roland has soured me on giving them my money.

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#1425525 - 10/20/15 09:31 AM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: Slabraton]
bear Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 6225
Loc: abq,nm,usa
There is a physical reason why pins have to be swapped in a RBUS cable

Inputs of one device must be connected to outputs of the other device for things to work.

If all hardware RBUS ports on all devices are to be identical, then the swapping HAS to be done in the cable...

I find it to be a fairly nice interface really, too bad it never caught on as a standard.

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#1425550 - 10/20/15 10:32 AM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: bear]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8163
Loc: Iowa
I think the point being that it would have been more sensible and cost saving (from the user perspective) to make the parts layout and wiring scheme at the devices conform to the wiring of the cables in the first place... I reference something like RME's use of a standard firewire cable to connect to their proprietary devices. Isn't that much the same situation? Or am I missing something?
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uptildawn

2013 Iowa City JazzFest sets!
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#1425554 - 10/20/15 11:02 AM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: uptildawn]
bear Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 6225
Loc: abq,nm,usa
Either the ports on the devices would have to be defined as an input port or an output port for different devices, or the cable needs to swap signals

RBUS chose to make ALL port identical... so to swap things such that ins on one device connect to outs on another, the cable must swap the signals...

In firewire (or RME derivation of it) one device is always the dedicated SLAVE and one the dedicated MASTER with different pinouts on the units themselves... Also there is only one data path each direction

In RBUS both ends are receivers and senders - to have a straight through cable the units would have to have to have defined types, some being masters and some being slaves... As it is, a RBUS port is always the same on every piece of equipment - it is neither a master or slave. Just continuous data streams (4 stereo each direction) are always flowing.

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#1425560 - 10/20/15 11:22 AM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: bear]
uptildawn Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8163
Loc: Iowa
Oh, I think I see... although I'm struggling to site another example at the moment.
I'm thinking there's some parallel to the use of SCSI ports and hooking up a VS directly to them is a No, No... except with VirDis, which resolves the issue at the pc card?
_________________________
uptildawn

2013 Iowa City JazzFest sets!
Dr Lonnie Smith Trio w/Jonathan Kreisberg on guitar
Pharoah Sanders Quartet
Fred Hersch Trio
These are post mixes set to single camera video (by Rich Rauch).

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#1425581 - 10/20/15 01:04 PM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: uptildawn]
bear Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 6225
Loc: abq,nm,usa
In SCSI there is a shared data bus that is very carefully controlled as to who is currently RECEIVING data and who is sending. The MASTER arbitrates this, a signal from it tells a slave when it is safe to take over the bus

This is why it is not safe to hook 2 VS together - they both try to be master and both try to grab the data bus which makes both ends fight each other - both are supplying current into the data bus.

In RBUS there is no arbitration - the data lines in each direction are constantly driven by both sides, 4TX -> 4RX from one side, and 4 TX->4RX form the other side at the same time.

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#1425638 - 10/20/15 03:32 PM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: bear]
Slabraton Offline
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Registered: 12/16/12
Posts: 11791
Loc: California
"This is why it is not safe to hook 2 VS together - they both try to be master and both try to grab the data bus which makes both ends fight each other - both are supplying current into the data bus."

Could you elaborate? It seems many here use two VS recorders synced.

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#1425644 - 10/20/15 04:10 PM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: Slabraton]
uptildawn Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8163
Loc: Iowa
VS recorders are sync'd via midi, not SCSI.

Thanks for the explanations, bear.
_________________________
uptildawn

2013 Iowa City JazzFest sets!
Dr Lonnie Smith Trio w/Jonathan Kreisberg on guitar
Pharoah Sanders Quartet
Fred Hersch Trio
These are post mixes set to single camera video (by Rich Rauch).

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#1425648 - 10/20/15 04:17 PM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: uptildawn]
Slabraton Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 12/16/12
Posts: 11791
Loc: California
Ok, I misread it.
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#1425761 - 10/21/15 09:16 AM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: Slabraton]
canefire Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 11/02/04
Posts: 619
Loc: Silver Spring , MD USA
So the next question to BEAR is:

When are you going to start making RBUS cables so VS users can buy them?

LOL

Is there anyway I can convince you to make and sell the RBUS cable?
Cheers,
Ian
_________________________
"A Cobra never wastes its venom on dead and fleeing things" - The Mantra of the Cobra

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#1522561 - 03/07/17 06:14 PM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: canefire]
EnzymeX Offline
Space Cadet


Registered: 12/12/16
Posts: 18
An old topic I realize, but I recently bought this adapter for $18.00 that lets any cheap DB-25 printer cable (male to male) become an R-BUS cable:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/122369757497?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

On the plus side, it works as advertised - just connect the adapter to either end of your printer cable.

The downsides are:

a) you need a really short and thin flathead screwdriver (not included) if you want to secure the adaptor to your R-BUS connector.

b) the added solid length at one end of the cable could be an issue for some tight installations.

This well established ebay seller appears to make these R-Bus adaptors himself, so you may want to follow the seller on ebay in case the above auction listing expires:

http://www.ebay.com/usr/aerogami?_trksid=p2047675.l2559


Edited by EnzymeX (03/08/17 02:36 AM)

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#1522586 - 03/08/17 09:43 AM Re: RBUS cable wanted [Re: EnzymeX]
EssOhEss Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 04/18/16
Posts: 67
Roland needed to create their own proprietary cabling format (RBUS) and regulate I/O to bleed more money from their users by manufacturing redundant addon boxes that you need to have to use already available standard devices like ADAT and AES. They could have just as easily made the RBUS port AES instead, which is also 8 channels I/O digital both directions, very similar using the same D-Sub25 pin connector. Or they could have even used ADAT I/O. The argument they needed to create their own proprietary format to specify inputs and outputs is rubbish. If that was true, why does every other manufacturer use standard I/O methods instead of a proprietary one like this? Roland needed to make addons for more profit, by crippling the users I/O capability forcing them to buy one of their addon boxes to conform to already available digital audio I/O standards. RBUS was a marketing scheme, plain and simple.
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