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#1595063 - 12/14/18 12:42 PM Favorite 2480 vocal effects
mobofsquirrels Offline
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Registered: 09/23/10
Posts: 105
I'm just curious as to what some of your favorite vocal effects are? As in, reverbs, delays, etc.
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#1595083 - 12/14/18 02:54 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: mobofsquirrels]
powermac Offline
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Registered: 02/21/16
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Loc: Houston, Tx
I love the "vocal multi." As I've learned it's quirks I've gotten to where it shines on most vocals. "Reverb" is also very rich sounding if it's dialed in right.
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#1595088 - 12/14/18 03:35 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: powermac]
mobofsquirrels Offline
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Registered: 09/23/10
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I've recently begun to use "vocal multi" as an insert effect for de-essing. It works pretty well for this. In the past, I've also used the other functions in the chain until I realized it was making it difficult to get the vocals to fit into the mix.

How do you dial in your reverb setting? I have been unable to find a satisfactory setting for Reverb1 or Reverb2.

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#1595111 - 12/14/18 05:46 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: mobofsquirrels]
wjgypsy Offline
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Registered: 08/27/12
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Loc: Athens, GA
The Space Echo. Love it on vocals, snare, guitar.
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#1595113 - 12/14/18 06:38 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: wjgypsy]
concubinefeeder Offline
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Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 58
Loc: Windsor, Ontario, Canada
I'm assuming the bulk of the 2480's built-in effects are the same as what's in the 1680? If so, I've always had a special fondness for TapeEcho201. Not sure how close it gets to the sound of the original Roland RE-201, but crank it up and you've got a slapback echo that would make Sam Phillips grin. Dial it back down to something more subtle and it becomes a completely different beast, adding some nice depth to a vocal track without calling much attention to itself.
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#1595136 - 12/14/18 10:27 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: concubinefeeder]
C Jo Go Offline
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I wrote a few stereo delays .. thats about all I use --


Mainly just use the internal card for the bass/kick comps and the guitar effects ....


tend to use my external effects for all the vocals
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#1595260 - 12/16/18 11:30 AM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: C Jo Go]
MrSpock Offline
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Registered: 12/11/18
Posts: 20
Loc: UK
Hi, I'm new to the VS2480. I just have the one, factory-installed FX card installed. I tried recording a vocal with 'Vocal Multi' as an insert effect applied whilst recording.

I then laid down a bass-line (again recorded 'with FX' - the bass DI preset 'Miked Cab'). I can't seem to 'unlock' the effects for anything else now (like a Reverb to be used as a global loop effect across the rest of my mix).

Do you guys tend to record 'dry' and add these effects (like 'Vocal Multi' for example) at the mix down stage?

Apols for the newbie questions! I'm used to recording & printing my input signals WITH effects at the time of tracking. (I'm coming from a Boss BR1600 background here.)

Thanks in advance to anyone who can clear this up for me (and show me how to free up these insert effects I used so I can get back to using my limited FX this end as send/loop FX!)

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#1595276 - 12/16/18 01:51 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: MrSpock]
powermac Offline
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Registered: 02/21/16
Posts: 272
Loc: Houston, Tx
Mr Spock, may I suggest that you consider using "Loop" effects. With one card your really locked down when inserting effects.

Edited by powermac (12/16/18 01:55 PM)

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#1595281 - 12/16/18 02:10 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: powermac]
MrSpock Offline
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Registered: 12/11/18
Posts: 20
Loc: UK
Thanks for the suggestion PowerMac. Take for example this 'Multi Vocal' setting (which actually sounded rather nice on my dulcit tones when I used it as an insert effect!)

If I just record 'dry' then (as in: no insert effect) is it possible to recreate the chain at the mix stage would you know?

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#1595284 - 12/16/18 02:19 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: powermac]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8052
Loc: Iowa
If you applied the effects as insert patches on the input mixer, then they should have printed to the track - If you applied them to the track mixer, then they are not printed and require a bounce record pass to another track, or tracks in order to print them.

You can test whether or not the effect(s) are actually printed a number of ways, but one simple method might be to temporarily move the recorded track(s) to another channel - with the VS 1680, I would usually use Track Exchange to quickly move the recording to an unused track, where no effects are currently applied. You can easily reverse this operation with a careful single-level of UNDO, or repeat the operation in the opposite direction, to put your recording back in their proper track order.

Once you are satisfied that they are indeed printed to the track as you planned, then you can remove the effect by simply un-inserting it from the track/mixer that you inserted it to begin with.

Granted, most often effects are used as loop (or Pre/Post) patches in order to maximize the use of a single effect across multiple channels and this is very handy, when you want the same effect on multiple channels. Reverbs are one such effect that work the best in a loop patch.

However, many effects are more appropriately patched as insert patches (or in-line) - your use of the bass DI Miked Cab is a good example. Recognize that you have multiple insert patch options with the 2480 - Insert, Insert Left, Insert Right and Insert Series. Sometimes using just the Left or Right can also free up half of the effect in order to use it on a second track simultaneously with the first - the Dual Compressor found on the version 2 card is a great example of this use.
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2013 Iowa City JazzFest sets!
Dr Lonnie Smith Trio w/Jonathan Kreisberg on guitar
Pharoah Sanders Quartet
Fred Hersch Trio
These are post mixes set to single camera video (by Rich Rauch).

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#1595286 - 12/16/18 02:28 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: MrSpock]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8052
Loc: Iowa
 Originally Posted By: MrSpock
Thanks for the suggestion PowerMac. Take for example this 'Multi Vocal' setting (which actually sounded rather nice on my dulcit tones when I used it as an insert effect!)

If I just record 'dry' then (as in: no insert effect) is it possible to recreate the chain at the mix stage would you know?


Recreating the effect chain after the fact - and with only one card onboard - is a dicey deal, for sure. Your best bet is to print the dry track, with its associated effect chain to an unused track well before your mix stage (especially when recording multiple instrument tracks). Do that by bouncing the dry and effect to an unused track in realtime.

Another option is to print only the effect sound (100% wet) to an unused track (or track pair for stereo effects).

In either case, you can do 2 things to preserve the original recording and effect chain - up to a point.

1- you can store a copy of any tracks and recorded effects to unused virtual layers for later recall as needed.

2- you can store any particular effect patch (including FX card multi-effect patches, but not multiple effect chains of individual patches) to a USER bank for later recall.
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uptildawn

2013 Iowa City JazzFest sets!
Dr Lonnie Smith Trio w/Jonathan Kreisberg on guitar
Pharoah Sanders Quartet
Fred Hersch Trio
These are post mixes set to single camera video (by Rich Rauch).

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#1595287 - 12/16/18 02:35 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: uptildawn]
MrSpock Offline
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Registered: 12/11/18
Posts: 20
Loc: UK
FAB! advice there uptildawn - thanks so much. I'm not at my machine at the moment but will print your reply off and work through it when I next record.


I'm pretty sure I inserted the effect(s) on the insert channels. What I couldn't work out at the time was exactly how to 'free up' the FX again so I could use them as loop effects - both FX boxes (just one card remember) were 'taken' by the sources I'd allocated the effects to.


I'll hopefully be able to free up the effects at my disposal after sitting down with your notes here & 'processing' it all.

Thanks again!

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#1595363 - 12/17/18 10:14 AM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: MrSpock]
keeppracticing Offline
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Registered: 07/13/12
Posts: 1155
Loc: Atlanta
All 3 card plugins for me:

T-Racks or UA compressor, Soundblender chorus & echoman delays, and TCR 3000 reverb

Sounds like the radio every time \:\)

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#1595390 - 12/17/18 12:38 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: keeppracticing]
MrSpock Offline
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Registered: 12/11/18
Posts: 20
Loc: UK
"Schweet!" Where's the best place to source some extra FX cards? Seems I'm somewhat limited having just one!
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#1595400 - 12/17/18 02:03 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: MrSpock]
mobofsquirrels Offline
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Registered: 09/23/10
Posts: 105
 Originally Posted By: MrSpock
"Schweet!" Where's the best place to source some extra FX cards? Seems I'm somewhat limited having just one!


Search eBay for "VS8F-2". There are some for sale there. They're probably used, so make sure they're returnable.

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#1595419 - 12/17/18 06:02 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: mobofsquirrels]
keeppracticing Offline
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Registered: 07/13/12
Posts: 1155
Loc: Atlanta
VS8F-2 fx are not nearly as good as the VS8F-3 card plugins. Not even close.
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#1595428 - 12/17/18 10:30 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: keeppracticing]
C Jo Go Offline
pseudo musician
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Registered: 11/05/01
Posts: 23149
Loc: carmel valley,ca
 Originally Posted By: keeppracticing
VS8F-2 fx are not nearly as good as the VS8F-3 card plugins. Not even close.
Wish had known that VS you got ~~~ was loaded -- sold them many years ago ..
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#1595432 - 12/18/18 03:20 AM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: C Jo Go]
MrSpock Offline
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Registered: 12/11/18
Posts: 20
Loc: UK
Well I headed over to fleaBay as suggested ... WTF?!! Over 400 (including postage!) for ONE card. They're completely dreaming, right? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/173424855692
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#1595448 - 12/18/18 09:47 AM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: MrSpock]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 8052
Loc: Iowa
Not a dream - in the minds of those who still have any to sell.
They're preciously scarce.... be especially careful to be sure that the effects you get for the 3-cards are or can be keyed to the card you have/get. There's a pretty convoluted authorization method attached to those things.
_________________________
uptildawn

2013 Iowa City JazzFest sets!
Dr Lonnie Smith Trio w/Jonathan Kreisberg on guitar
Pharoah Sanders Quartet
Fred Hersch Trio
These are post mixes set to single camera video (by Rich Rauch).

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#1595450 - 12/18/18 10:09 AM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: mobofsquirrels]
powermac Offline
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Registered: 02/21/16
Posts: 272
Loc: Houston, Tx
 Originally Posted By: mobofsquirrels
I've recently begun to use "vocal multi" as an insert effect for de-essing. It works pretty well for this. In the past, I've also used the other functions in the chain until I realized it was making it difficult to get the vocals to fit into the mix.

How do you dial in your reverb setting? I have been unable to find a satisfactory setting for Reverb1 or Reverb2.
I don't use Vocal Multi for de-essing. I use a sharp Q with my EQ to find the frequency and eliminate it, or at least pull it down. I'm a big proponent of subtractive EQ and many times don't push the settings unless it calls for it.

As far as Reverb settings it varies. However, one of the things that can make a difference with effects is to pull out some of the low end on the effect. It will help your vocals sit in the mix better.

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#1595452 - 12/18/18 10:13 AM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: MrSpock]
powermac Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 02/21/16
Posts: 272
Loc: Houston, Tx
 Originally Posted By: MrSpock
Well I headed over to fleaBay as suggested ... WTF?!! Over 400 (including postage!) for ONE card. They're completely dreaming, right? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/173424855692
In my opinion you can create a darn good production with the 2 cards as long as you understand how to use them. I've done a lot of recording with great results using my four 2 cards. That's where I would start.

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#1595463 - 12/18/18 11:42 AM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: powermac]
C Jo Go Offline
pseudo musician
Planeteer


Registered: 11/05/01
Posts: 23149
Loc: carmel valley,ca
We have 3 TC electronics effects -( true mono or stereo effects ) & about half the price of the cards .. and 100's of presets --- the only expensive part was the AE 7000 -- to access them digitally through the RBUS ...
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#1595484 - 12/18/18 02:59 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: powermac]
mobofsquirrels Offline
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Registered: 09/23/10
Posts: 105
 Originally Posted By: powermac
As far as Reverb settings it varies. However, one of the things that can make a difference with effects is to pull out some of the low end on the effect. It will help your vocals sit in the mix better.


That's an interesting suggestion, and I can imagine that would solve some of the issues I'm having with Reverb1. I will definitely give it a try!

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#1595500 - 12/18/18 06:36 PM Re: Favorite 2480 vocal effects [Re: mobofsquirrels]
powermac Offline
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Registered: 02/21/16
Posts: 272
Loc: Houston, Tx
 Originally Posted By: mobofsquirrels
 Originally Posted By: powermac
As far as Reverb settings it varies. However, one of the things that can make a difference with effects is to pull out some of the low end on the effect. It will help your vocals sit in the mix better.


That's an interesting suggestion, and I can imagine that would solve some of the issues I'm having with Reverb1. I will definitely give it a try!
Another thing to consider is to initially use delay on your vocal track (say around 240ms) and get a good sound that's not to wet. Then add a reverb to taste.

Learning how to use delay on vocals will open up your reverb, and you'll find that you'll use far less of it (reverb) in your vocal mix. If you begin with a verb you can tend to oversaturate and muddy... What delay time and how much to use is really dependent on what type of vocal cadence your writing... It's pretty much an experimental thing to find your personal delay, but when you do, it will open your vocals way up.


Edited by powermac (12/18/18 06:43 PM)

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