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#1543407 - 08/26/17 03:04 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
jerry1d Offline
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Registered: 02/17/10
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I have pulled out other verified cf cards to troubleshoot and the return msg was the same:

"Found Roland VS drive at: \\.\PhysicalDrive1"

"read \\.\PhysicalDrive1: The drive cannot find the sector requested".

I'm amazed that you are helping us without even having an actual VS-1680 there to test. I have no experience writing software and can only assist by feeding back info to you. I wondered if my USB 3 port might affect the read so switched to usb 2 but had the same result.

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#1543423 - 08/26/17 06:43 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
randygo Offline
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Registered: 10/11/06
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There could still be a bug in the partition/cluster logic. I am able to read the VS-1680 SD card uptildawn sent me, it has a few partitions and a number of songs on it. If you'd like to snail mail me a sample SD card with a SASE, I can send it back to you once I look at it. PM me for my address.
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#1543691 - 08/30/17 12:29 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
jerry1d Offline
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Randy re CF VS 1680 drive I have pm'd you.

jerr1d

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#1543747 - 08/30/17 10:36 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
randygo Offline
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jerry1d, I haven't received your CF yet, but today I found an issue with a real CF card of my own vs the CF/SD adapter combo I had been using. I've improved the drive size detection and now get no errors with my CF card. I hope this build works for you!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qv94d0qbay46a4f/vs.exe?dl=0

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#1543761 - 08/31/17 12:06 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
uptildawn Offline
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any further development with the 32 bit issue yet?
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#1543776 - 08/31/17 01:36 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
randygo Offline
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uptildawn, the latest build I posted in the link above is built as a 32-bit executable.
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#1543784 - 08/31/17 03:59 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
uptildawn Offline
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If you check your pm's, you'll see that it did not work when I tried it.
I laid out details as much as I was able as to how far I got. Been waiting to hear back from you - need assistance to figure out what's wrong.
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#1543785 - 08/31/17 04:09 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
randygo Offline
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uptildawn, sorry it is not working for you \:\( I should not have shared. I'm upset myself because I am able to load and convert the SD card you sent me without issue, but you are not. I've been building 32-bit versions lately, but I don't have a 32-bit system to test with. I'm sorry that I can only provide a command line utility and not a GUI. I am running Windows 10 64-bit with some knowledge of the command line - any variance from that, and there are many, may have issues. I'm sure with a few more testers I can work out the environmental kinks. I'm waiting for feedback from jerry1d on my latest build. Perhaps we will be closer to success.

Cheers,

Randy

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#1543787 - 08/31/17 04:30 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
uptildawn Offline
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I will tackle it again on my own then when I get some time - soon. I could get as far as seeing the info about the program, but never got to anything resembling the list and take view you posted for me. I guess - I KNOW - I don't know enough about how to use the Command line........ anything I learned is a fog way, way back in time, I'm afraid.
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#1543804 - 08/31/17 05:47 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
jerry1d Offline
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SWEET FANCY MOSES IT'S ALIVE! Works like a champ Randy!

Sounds so sweet and clear, when I played it a Unicorn appeared at my window just to listen.

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#1543810 - 08/31/17 06:25 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
jerry1d Offline
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I can confirm that on a Windows 10/64bit PC, with a CF card from a VS-1680 VS.EXE converted RDAC encoded song files into individual WAV files automatically deposited into a folder in the current directory titled the same as the song. I used the VS Get "My Song" command to do this.
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#1543818 - 08/31/17 07:46 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
randygo Offline
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Glad to hear that!!! Let me know if you have any issues.

Cheers,

Randy

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#1543825 - 08/31/17 08:15 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
jerry1d Offline
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Thanks, will do.
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#1543832 - 08/31/17 10:08 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
jerry1d Offline
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This may sound strange, but If this process works in one direction, wouldn't it be possible to go the other way? For instance, let's say I record 8 tracks in one pass in MTP mode on my 1680, then do another pass of 8 tracks in MTP for a total now of 16 tracks. Let's say I wish to use your excellent VS.EXE prg to convert these RDAC encoded song files to .WAV files for importation into Reaper for easier visual editing and sweetening. <-------Now, for some crazy idea I wish to go back the other way and have these Reaper edited .Wav files return, en masse, to the VS-1680 to be seen and behave like they had never left, only better, for having taken advantage of the modern advanced editing functions of today's DAW's.
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#1543837 - 08/31/17 11:32 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
randygo Offline
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Registered: 10/11/06
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In theory, yes. But the effort to do that would be overwhelming. I have no idea how to encode to RDAC, only decode. Encoding would require research into which of the 30+ RDAC pattern styles would be used for each 16 sample block. Then there is the problem of writing the timeline data into Roland's proprietary event file. Reading it and figuring out how it represents events was hard enough. But the real show-stopper would be to implement the low-level clusterfucked FAT16 file write operations. This is something I don't even want to start to think about! \:\)
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#1543848 - 09/01/17 12:38 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
uptildawn Offline
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There is already a method to do what you ask jerry1d, but it requires using a VS recorder that has .wav file import ability, like the 2480. I realize it's not the SAME as what you're describing, but in essence, that's what .wav file import (and export) is about in those VS recorders.

I've personally felt the way you do about the subject for a really long time and have always wondered why Roland never got behind an effort to make our VS creations more compatible with the outside world of audio recording... it's frustrating, if you let it get that way.
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#1543851 - 09/01/17 12:49 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
jerry1d Offline
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Registered: 02/17/10
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LOL! Yeah, it would be a clusterfuck, there's much more benefit going the other direction anyway.

Just for discussion, below is an excerpt from an article I found by someone in Japan who is able to import 64 simultaneous Wav files into the 1680. I wondered if formatting a CF as a VS 840/880 or BR-8 might work as a replacement whenever we see the word "Zip Disk" in the article. I don't believe MTP mode could be achieved in this scenario as the VS 88X series didn't have it. Anyway, it's an interesting read. Cheers, jerry


EXCERPT FROM ARTICLE
"One of the things that I wanted to do was to import and export WAV files using the Roland VS-1680. After some research and testing, I found a workflow that is extremely fast and quite easy. The method I use is to connect an external Zip drive to the back of the VS-1680. In my Windows 7 computer I also have an internal Zip drive.

To export WAV files, I simply save the song I am working on to an external Epson ZIP drive using the Roland VS-1680. Then I put the disk in my desktop computer's Zip drive that I salvaged from a broken Roland SP-808. After that, I fire up a program called VS WAVE Exporter that allows me to select and export the song with all the tracks to WAV format. Then I can use my favorite DAW to load the WAV files and further mix or tweak the song.

To import WAV files back into the VS-1680, that is super easy as well. What you need is a Roland VS-840 formatted zip disk. For those who don’t have a Roland VS-840, you just need to have a zip disk with the formatted files on it. Then, you simply have to insert the zip disk into the internal zip drive of the PC and fire up another program called the Roland BR8 to WAV Converter program. This program will recognize the VS-840 disk as a BR-8 compatible disk and allow you to convert WAV files into the Roland VS format. The BR-8 Wav Converter allows you to convert 64 WAV files per song. Each WAV file is converted to an assigned track of your choosing (1 - 8 and any one of 8 virtual tracks). Next, take the Zip disk out and stick it into the Roland VS-1680. There you use the VS-840 import command to import the files to the VS-1680 song project. Presto! All of your WAV files or wAV tracks will be nicely imported and assigned to the proper tracks. The key to importing and exporting WAV files easily is that you need a Zip drive connected to your Roland VS-1680 and your computer".




Edited by jerry1d (09/03/17 03:31 PM)

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#1543855 - 09/01/17 02:47 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
jerry1d Offline
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Registered: 02/17/10
Posts: 142
Sent you a pm Uptildawn
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#1543860 - 09/01/17 04:29 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
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jerry, just had to move your pm to this thread - it really helped me crack the nut (my brain) and figure out what I was doing wrong.... it works now!

Quote:
Uptildawn, I read on the VS.EXE post that you might be having issues with Randygo's 32bit prg. I can help you if you'd like regarding the installation and command line functions.

Put your SD card in your PC. Open your C drive and drop Randy's VS app there and don't put it in a folder. Go to your start button within Windows and launch "Command Prompt (Admin). I believe you will then see: C:\Windows\system32>

Now type this: cd c:\ and then hit the enter key.
Now type this: vs.exe and then hit the enter key.

This should bring up Randy's program.


Next type this: vs list then hit enter.
This will take off and return showing the partition and song info on your SD card.

Now type this: vs get "My Song" and hit enter

Uptildawn, pls note that you must use the quotes and where it says my song that just means the name of any of your songs on the SD card.

You will now see the conversion process creating wav files.
Now go to your C drive where you placed the VS program. You will see a folder with your songs name and in it the converted wav files.

I hope this helps, let me know. Cheers, jerry... END QUOTE

So, now I've got the converter working as randy has said it should and I just wasn't seeing about command prompt instructions. Not only that, but I've got a screen shot of my process in command prompt pasted into a word doc for future reference, where I can understand how to make various variations as the need arises. YaY!

I've also got everything directed to a specific folder on the data drive (I use a separate hard drive for that) and the songs get extracted to that folder so they don't clutter up the main D drive and they're easier for me to locate later after windows shuffles everything up in alphabetical order (in this view I use). It's great so far, as I put everything in my VSWE Roland Rips main folder. Now I can experiment with another idea or two as time allows.

Thanks for the assist!!!! And thanks again to randy for making this new revival stage possible! I really like how the displayed list is complete with record mode, bit rate and partition location of the songs! That is really useful in my opinion.





Edited by uptildawn (09/01/17 04:31 AM)
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uptildawn

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#1543863 - 09/01/17 06:21 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
randygo Offline
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Registered: 10/11/06
Posts: 334
Loc: Washington
Yay! Thanks for helping out. I've been busy and can only devote so much time to this "project" \:\) I'm hoping to find a web host where I can publish the vs.exe along with some more detailed instructions. I used to have a small website hosted by Comcast, but they dropped that feature some time ago. Or maybe I'll just set up a GitHub account and post the code - but first I would have to find out what that would cost and refactor and clean up my code so it is something I would feel comfortable with making public. It is a bit of a mess at the moment.

If either of you or anybody else on this forum wants to publish this latest build somewhere on the web I would be fine with that.

Cheers,

Randy

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#1543864 - 09/01/17 06:44 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
jerry1d Offline
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Registered: 02/17/10
Posts: 142
Glad to help Uptildawn!

It's a nice, elegant program Randy has written. He has done all the hard work on this, we can help with the documentation and instruction. There are many ways to organize the install, how we choose to work within the Windows OS, and where files can go based on his program's options. Most of us seldom use the old DOS commands and thankfully only a couple lines are needed to setup the program.

And Randy's program does more than just convert VS song files to Wav files, it also automatically creates a Reaper project file (RPP) which is also handy.

The official name of the program is:
"Roland VS to Reaper Project Converter"



Edited by jerry1d (09/01/17 06:46 AM)

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#1543877 - 09/01/17 04:25 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
randygo Offline
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Registered: 10/11/06
Posts: 334
Loc: Washington

>it also automatically creates a Reaper project file (RPP) which is also handy.

I would say that it is more "essential" than "handy" \:\) That is, if you are interested in recreating the actual tracks from the events. My program translates the takes directly into WAVs, it does not assemble all the WAVs into tracks. With the Reaper project file, that is easy if you open Reaper and then render whatever tracks you want as stems.

Randy

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#1543892 - 09/01/17 08:09 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
jerry1d Offline
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Registered: 02/17/10
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So is there any difference in sound quality or content if the converted wav from your program are placed independently into say Abelton as opposed to Reaper? Or does this just mean that the wav files will line up in Reaper and assume the track positioning they had within the VS workstation?
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#1543900 - 09/01/17 08:45 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
uptildawn Offline
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I've just loaded a song into reaper that had multiple short segments of audio recorded alongside a full track and a number of comp'd sections. Not only does reaper line up the tracks in their original timeline position, but it clearly shows the multiple overdubs as individual regions, as I am used to seeing on a computer daw.

I didn't have a song handy that used the v-tracks underneath track layer 1 yet, so don't know if reaper will display them in layers as the roland does, or in parallel tracks, side-by-side, as it always did in the early versions.

As to you question about sound quality, I would have to say you can expect the tracks to sound essentially the same from daw to daw and very much like you're used to hearing them sound in the VS through the same monitoring system.

I don't think you will get mixer parameters, processing and effects to translate into the reaper session, if you had things arranged a certain way in the original roland song...... I could be wrong and I am guessing, because that's how VSWE works.... I haven't had a chance to check into it.
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#1543910 - 09/01/17 10:57 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
randygo Offline
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The WAVs will sound the same in any DAW, but if you want them in a track, aligned in time in another DAW, you will need to open the project file in Reaper and export the tracks of interest as stems (a track is simply the WAV events sequenced in time). Then you can load those exported tracks into another DAW. Reaper's project file format is fairly "open". It is an XML-like text file which was easy for me to create from the event timeline info contained within Roland's EVENTLST file for the song. I already had some old code from the Reaper plugin that performed much of the formatting functions that was easy to convert. Mixer parameters, effects, and other things are hidden away somewhere in those proprietary Roland files, but I'm not willing to expend the effort to try to decipher that and translate it into something Reaper can recognize in the project file.

All events for the song, including vtracks, will be converted to WAVs. All tracks for the song, including vtracks, will be represented in the Reaper project file. The track name will be of the form "TrackX-Y", where X is the track number and Y is the vtrack number. If a track/vtrack has no events, it will not appear in the Reaper project file.

Cheers,

Randy

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#1543981 - 09/03/17 12:18 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
Minnesotan Offline
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Registered: 09/02/17
Posts: 9
@Randygo...

I would be willing to host it for you and make the link available on this forum... how do I get the "final" x64 and x32 versions??

I'm amazed at the work you've done here, randygo... truly amazed. I just joined this forum in order to research ways to accomplish just exactly this task.

BRAVO!!! and THANKS!!


Edited by Minnesotan (09/03/17 12:21 AM)

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#1544209 - 09/06/17 03:24 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: Minnesotan]
randygo Offline
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Registered: 10/11/06
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Loc: Washington
Minnesotan,

Here is the most recent version:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qv94d0qbay46a4f/vs.exe?dl=0

Feel free to rehost the EXE anywhere! Its working for me the way I want and its working for the few others here now who have tried it.

I'll try to get the source up on GitHub soon if I have time or energy \:\)

Cheers,

Randy

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#1544236 - 09/06/17 03:43 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: randygo]
Minnesotan Offline
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Registered: 09/02/17
Posts: 9
Hi Randygo,

Thanks for the download link... done!

I assume that this is the x64 version, yes??

If so, is the x32 version still the same as the last time you posted it, and if so are you OK with that being made available to forum users also??

Once again, I thank you for your work on this... it's a "lifesaver" for some of us!!

Best regards,

Terry

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#1544246 - 09/06/17 06:43 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: Minnesotan]
Minnesotan Offline
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Registered: 09/02/17
Posts: 9
Hello to @uptildawn and @jerry1d...

Would you either or both of you folks be willing to do a quick "how-to" tutorial/guide for using this program that Randy has written?? It would doubtless be of great help to folks (like myself) who have no first-hand knowledge of this type of procedure... and thus help prevent the errors that could easily be encountered without any guidance.

I could then include it with the 32x and 64x programs in a downloadable package for other forum users.

Many thanks...

Terry

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#1544280 - 09/07/17 04:09 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: Minnesotan]
jerry1d Offline
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Registered: 02/17/10
Posts: 142
Sure, here are the steps to installing and using Randygo's Roland VS to Reaper Project Converter on a PC running Windows 10:

1. Download the 32 or 64bit program to your PC.

2. Locate this downloaded VS.exe file and place on desktop

3. Right click Windows 10 start button and choose file
explorer

4. Click on Local Disk (C:)

5. Drag VS.exe into the C: drive root directory

6. Connect your SDHC/CF mem card or IDE drive containing VS workstation song files to your computer

7. Right click Windows start button and launch "Command Prompt
(Admin)".

8. You should then see: C:\Windows\system32>

9. Now type this: cd c:\ then hit the enter key.

10. Now type this: vs.exe then hit the enter key.

You should now see Randy's Roland VS to Reaper Project Converter.


11. Next type this: vs list then hit enter.
This will take off and return showing the partition and
song info on your SD/CF card connected to the PC

12. Next type this: vs get "My Song" and hit enter

note that you must use the quotes. Where it says "my song"
that just means you need to enter whatever song name you
wish to convert as seen on the SD/CF card.

You will see the conversion process creating wav files.

13. Now go to your C drive where you placed the VS.exe prg earlier. You will see a folder has been created with your songs name and the converted wav files in it.

14. Repeat the process from step 12 onward to convert whatever
additional songs you wish

15. Finally just place these wave files into Reaper or
whichever DAW app you use for further
tweaking/editing/mixing.

16. Reflect on how lucky we are to have enhanced functionality beyond Roland's initial design structure due to the tireless, selfless efforts, of Randygo!


Have Fun!


Edited by jerry1d (09/07/17 05:07 AM)

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#1544281 - 09/07/17 04:55 AM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
jerry1d Offline
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Registered: 02/17/10
Posts: 142
Given the density of this thread and the direction it has taken perhaps it should be re-titled "Roland VS to Reaper Project Converter".
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#1544285 - 09/07/17 01:34 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: jerry1d]
Minnesotan Offline
Space Cadet


Registered: 09/02/17
Posts: 9
@jerry1d

Thank you SO MUCH!!

That write-up will help enormously, I've no doubt. I will give it all a "trial run" this weekend myself, as I have a bunch of songs that I want to get into Reaper (which is what brought me to this forum in the first place). Assuming all goes well, I will then post a downloadable package for other forum members to access.

Once again, many thanks to @Randygo, @jerry1d and @uptildawn for this VS-to-Reaper transfer facility... fabulous work indeed!!

Terry

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#1544288 - 09/07/17 02:44 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: Minnesotan]
uptildawn Offline
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Registered: 12/15/01
Posts: 9118
Loc: on land
Don't forget that randy has provided a reaper-specific file in the extraction folder. Opening it in reaper will bring all the newly created wav files into it in their correct timeline orientation. If working in Reaper, then it's a no brainer to use this method, instead of just importing the wav files in and then having to realign them manually.
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uptildawn

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#1544289 - 09/07/17 03:01 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: uptildawn]
Minnesotan Offline
Space Cadet


Registered: 09/02/17
Posts: 9
 Originally Posted By: uptildawn
Don't forget that randy has provided a reaper-specific file in the extraction folder. Opening it in reaper will bring all the newly created wav files into it in their correct timeline orientation. If working in Reaper, then it's a no brainer to use this method, instead of just importing the wav files in and then having to realign them manually.


Ahhh... THANK YOU @uptildawn!! This Reaper-specific file resides in the same folder as the wave files?? Boy, that would sure save a lot of time and aggrevation... thanks again for that insight. Looking forward to trying all this out over the weekend.

Terry

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#1544291 - 09/07/17 04:48 PM Re: Copying from VS-1880 IDE drives to PC [Re: Minnesotan]
jerry1d Offline
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Registered: 02/17/10
Posts: 142
The Reaper-specific file will be in the folder created by the program itself. Move the entire folder to where you keep your Reaper songs. While running Reaper, open this folder, as you would any other song folder, and click on the generated song file with the (.RPP) extension. This will place the song's contents onto Reaper's main screen displaying the tracks in their correct position and timeline.
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