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#482798 - 03/18/04 09:28 PM •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Brad Lyons Offline
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Registered: 01/31/02
Posts: 8776
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Hello gang, just thought I would bring some information to the Planet from a meeting I just had with Roland's own popular Laura Tyson.  Once again, I'm amazed at what kind of doors this is going to open up for VS owners that no other product is capable of doing.  Many have been asking WHEN these cards will be available and the answer is still "sooooon" :-) Actually, shipping by April 10th is the expectation at this point and Roland is usually very good about dates.  While there are (5) really cool Roland plugins shipping free with the VS8F3 card, the actual third-party plugins will be shortly there-after with most of them shipping by the end of April and a few coming in May.  These dates can change, but this is the target thus far.  Unfortunately, we won't know what kind of DSP each plugin is using until these are available.  Some of them may give you up to 2 stereo (or 1 "big" stereo) plugins depending on the complexity of the effect, but the fact that you can easily print an effect to disk on a Virtual Track really makes this a non-issue anyway.  

One IMPORTANT note for those of you on the VS1680/1880/1824, these cards WILL work.... but not right away.  There will be a software update (most likely around June) that enables the VS8F3 card to work on these models.  If anyone has any specific questions, as usual I'm more than happy to respond offline (or online if it benefits the rest of the Planet).
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Thank you, Brad Lyons
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#482799 - 03/18/04 11:46 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
FarOdyssey Offline
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Registered: 01/27/02
Posts: 400
how many plugins can you install on a single card? not actually mix with at once, just have stored on there before you have to go out and buy another vs8f-3?

oh yea, and i've been reading on some of these retail websites that the vs8f-3 now includes a "true" stereo reverb. what does that imply about the stereo reverbs on the vs8f-2 units?

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#482800 - 03/19/04 01:41 AM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Brad Lyons Offline
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Registered: 01/31/02
Posts: 8776
Loc: Atlanta, GA
You can install as many plugins that you purchase as you like. The VS8F3 only provides the processing to run the card as well as the authorization for the plugin(s) itself. Yes, the STEREO REVERB is included which is based on Roland's SRV series reverbs. It's pretty good actually, but the TC plugin is definitely worth the $$ to get along with the card if you want a really nice reverb.
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Thank you, Brad Lyons
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http://www.theaudioprofessional.com
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#482801 - 03/19/04 06:34 AM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
rhapsody Offline
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Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 37
Loc: New York
Hi Brad,

I'm new to the forum and I have a question for you regarding the new card. I was deciding between the DPS24 and the VS2480cd. Now that Rolands coming out with the new plug-in board.I'm leaning more to the VS.My question is this, the board ships with 5 Roland plug-ins and on Rolands site they say you can install up to 2 plug-ins per card.Does this mean you can only install two out of the 5 Roland plug-ins to be installed? If thats the case then you would need another card to add the 3rd party plug-ins.Am I understanding this right?
Thanks Tom

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#482802 - 03/19/04 06:46 AM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Randyman... Offline
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Registered: 03/30/02
Posts: 8673
Loc: Houston, TX
If I understand correctly, the Plugs are actually loaded in to a type of Flash Rom, and stored on the card (or in the 2480's Flash - not sure).

When you want to run a specific plug, you would tell the card to load the desired plug, and begin running it (like having all of your programs loaded on your PC, but only runnig what you need at the time).

You can likely store all of the avalible plugs on the card, and "Load" them as you need them. Just shooting in the wind...

I am on the fence about pre-ordering, but I know they will be snapped up quickly once released. Time will tell...

Later
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#482803 - 03/19/04 07:00 AM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Brad Lyons Offline
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Registered: 01/31/02
Posts: 8776
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Randy is correct, you can "install" all plugins available (and those still to come) into the VS but you can only load as many plugins as each VS8F3 card will run. This is what remains to be determined is which plugins use how much DSP to run.
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Thank you, Brad Lyons
Account Manager- GC PRO, ATLANTA
http://www.theaudioprofessional.com
(404)844-9758
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#482804 - 03/19/04 07:09 AM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Jeff G Offline
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Registered: 11/27/00
Posts: 814
Loc: Evart, MI, USA
Brad,
First, thanks for the update. Truly appreciated.
Has anyone seen how the plug ins will look on the little fish finder screen on the 1680 or 1880. Or will there be some type of upgrade to allow an external vga monitor on these units?
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#482805 - 03/19/04 07:34 AM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
SteveM Offline
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Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 1440
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Actually, I think the plug-in's are stored on the hard drive. Not a big deal, but something you must consider when formatting the drive.
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-Steve

It is the essential nature of man to play - Plato

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#482806 - 03/19/04 07:36 AM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Brett LaCroix Offline
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Registered: 01/24/03
Posts: 2005
Loc: Newport, Oregon
"Has anyone seen how the plug ins will look on the little fish finder screen on the 1680 or 1880."

I don't think anyone has seen this because it is still being developed...

\:\) Brett
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#482807 - 03/19/04 09:52 AM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
swallowingspiders Offline
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Registered: 03/10/03
Posts: 189
Loc: Oklahoma
Sweet.
Now hows about some info on the new TD 20's?
I heard a rumor that Guitar Center will be getting the first 90 (supposedly shipped out yesterday)because of some companies underpricing the kits. And the others will go out mid to late april. Sounds absurd to me, but not unheard of.
Any truth to this?
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#482808 - 03/19/04 02:16 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Brad Lyons Offline
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Registered: 01/31/02
Posts: 8776
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Steve,

they are loaded onto the hard-drive, but the authorizations are stored onto the VS card. I've seen the Roland plugins on the computer display, but I did not ask if they come up on the display itself. My guess is the graphics won't be as detailed, but you'll still have the controls there. BUT this is purely a guess at this point. As to VGA connectors for those units, no that is not going to happen.

Swallow.... What I can say is that the TD20's are going to be very hard to kit for some time.
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Thank you, Brad Lyons
Account Manager- GC PRO, ATLANTA
http://www.theaudioprofessional.com
(404)844-9758
blyons@gcpro.com

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#482809 - 03/19/04 05:08 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Jazzooo Offline
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Registered: 05/18/02
Posts: 55618
Loc: San Miguel de Allende, Mexico ...
"Actually, I think the plug-in's are stored on the hard drive. Not a big deal, but something you must consider when formatting the drive.
"

I believe this was a addressed a while back in the "ask Laura" forum. It wasn't going to be a problem, if I remember correctly.
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#482810 - 03/19/04 05:19 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
FarOdyssey Offline
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Registered: 01/27/02
Posts: 400
sorry, my question was wether or not the reverb on the vs8f-2 card is stereo or not? what is the difference between stereo and "true" stereo? anybody know? thanks...
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#482811 - 03/19/04 06:08 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
axeman Offline
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Registered: 04/01/01
Posts: 3475
Loc: 2480's mother board
fo, that is an interesting question. what is the difference between stereo and "true" stereo? looking forward to the answer.
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#482812 - 03/19/04 06:20 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Randyman... Offline
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Registered: 03/30/02
Posts: 8673
Loc: Houston, TX
"True" stereo will have stereo inputs, and the algorithm will process sounds as they are panned in the soundstage to re-create more of a complete sense of a virtual space to the listener.

Regular "Stereo" reverb will take a mono input, and create a quasi stereo ambiance with no reguard to instrument soundstage (panning).

Now, I do recall reading the plugs will be STORED on the HD, and a "Plug-in Backup" utility will be added along with the existing "Project Backup" to allow archiving/backup of the plugs to CD-R for re-formatting, etc...

I'm sure there is a better description, but that's all I got in me noggen (2.5 hours of sleep)

Later
_________________________
Audio + PC is the place to be
Randy V.
Audio-Dude/Musician/Crazy Guy


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#482813 - 03/19/04 06:22 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
kavish Offline
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Registered: 05/12/02
Posts: 3002
Loc: the home of KrispyKreme and C...
Steve,
I couldn't find plugin backup addressed when searching the "Ask Laura" forum, but I did dig up this thread from the "NAMM" forum, where Hook talks about the roland reps telling him about plugin backup and recovery functions, which would let you reload your plugins after a reformat:

http://www.vsplanet.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=38;t=000058#000003

Far,
My understanding is that the stereo fx in the VS8F-2 in the 2480 are mono in/stereo out, whereas "true stereo", is stereo in/stereo out, such as in my Lexicon MPX500 and the new Roland plugin, which have two separate DSP engines allowing the user to assign the amount of signal sent to either/both sides of the processor.
This allows stereo field positioning of the fx return unavailable with a mono in/stereo out processor.

Interestingly, 1680 users who have moved up to the 2480 have said that true stereo FX are available on the VS8F2 FX in the 1680, with individual left and right channel FX sends, but it seems it was one of the corners cut in the 2480's design. To accomplish the same thing on the 2480 you could use the same patch in 2 FX spots and hard pan the returns.
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#482814 - 03/19/04 07:24 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Brad Lyons Offline
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Registered: 01/31/02
Posts: 8776
Loc: Atlanta, GA
You can reload plugins, you just can't re-authorize them.
_________________________
Thank you, Brad Lyons
Account Manager- GC PRO, ATLANTA
http://www.theaudioprofessional.com
(404)844-9758
blyons@gcpro.com

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#482815 - 03/19/04 08:26 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
bbadger Offline
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Registered: 07/24/03
Posts: 117
Loc: Colorado Springs, CO
 Quote:
Originally posted by kavish:

Interestingly, 1680 users who have moved up to the 2480 have said that true stereo FX are available on the VS8F2 FX in the 1680, with individual left and right channel FX sends, but it seems it was one of the corners cut in the 2480's design.
That is incorrect.

The reverb patches on the 1680 and the 2480 are identical. In both cases the reverb is a stereo (uncorrelated two-channel) reverb output generated from a mono (summed L and R) input.
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Brian Badger

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#482816 - 03/19/04 09:34 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Hook Administrator Offline
Admin / Slacker
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Registered: 01/03/01
Posts: 6526
Loc: Venice, FL
From what I remember at NAMM, the Roland folks told us that when you install a plug-in, it "registers" itself to the first VS8F-3 card you have installed (in order of the effect slots). So, if you have a VS8F-2 installed in slot 1, a VS8F-3 card installed in slot 2, and another VS8F-3 card installed in slot 3, then the effects get "registered" to the VS8F-3 card in slot 2. This means that you could remove the VS8F-3 card in slot 3 and all the new plugins would still be able to run. But, if you remove the VS8F-3 card in slot 2, then the new plugins would no longer run, even if you had the other VS8F-3 card in slot 3.

That probably sounds a lot more confusing than it really is. ;\)
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#482817 - 03/19/04 10:32 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
Arjan van Gog Offline
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Registered: 01/12/04
Posts: 1243
Loc: The Netherlands
Hook,

I seem to remember from another NAMM thread that there has to be at least one VS8F-3 card plugged into slot 1. If I have to guess the VS8F-3 card simply provides a unique serial number, acting as a dongle, which is supposedly burned to the unfinalized CD-R they come on. This would probably allow you to re-install those plug-ins again and again from the CD-R as long as that exact same VS8F-3 card (same S/N) is in slot 1 of that VS machine. The new backup/restore facility for the plug-ins is probably just a faster way that does not require you to keep those original CD-Rs handy and also stores the S/N of the VS8F-3 card in the backup file.

Note that this would mean that if you want to sell a used plug-in to someone else you will need to sell it including the VS8F-3 card that was in slot 1 of your VS when you installed the plug-in.

This all makes perfect sense to me. I program our PC software to use Sentinel SuperPro dongles from Rainbow to protect against copying and this is probably how I would do it.

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#482818 - 03/19/04 10:55 PM Re: •••SHIPPING SOON....VS8F3 CARD and PLUGIN UPDATE•••
kavish Offline
Planeteer


Registered: 05/12/02
Posts: 3002
Loc: the home of KrispyKreme and C...
 Quote:
Originally posted by bbadger:
That is incorrect.

The reverb patches on the 1680 and the 2480 are identical. In both cases the reverb is a stereo (uncorrelated two-channel) reverb output generated from a mono (summed L and R) input.
Thanks for the clarification, bbadger. I wonder what they meant, then. I'll try to find one of the threads.
_________________________
kavish

Check out my band on our MySpace page:
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