#972208 - 04/17/10 11:01 PM
sticky faders
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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My VS-2400CD motorized faders are getting stuck all the time, or go to the wrong place, or move slowly... This is no doubt due to the cat hair (I have 2 cats). What's the best way to clean them up ? What about the easiest way ?
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#972398 - 04/18/10 06:45 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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itchybrother
Artist # 454
Planeteer
Registered: 11/16/03
Posts: 1176
Loc: BongoCongo
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search the 2480 forum. this has been discussed with some some fixes and no-no's. prolly dont spray stuff.
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#972497 - 04/19/10 01:34 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: itchybrother]
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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itchybrother,
I searched, but the only thing I found was this :
http://www.vsplanet.com/ubbthreads/ubbth...true#Post865784
There are not a lot of details, at least not enough for me. I took my VS-2400 upside down and opened it up. But it appears that I will have to disconnect basically every single thing before I can get to the fader board. Undoing the drives was fine. But when it comes to every motherboard connection, that is way more difficult. Some of them are so tight that I wonder if they are not actually soldered. Perhaps the fader board is easier to remove in the 2480 than the 2400, but I somewhat doubt it.
Any help would be appreciated. Especially how to guide with pictures on opening up the rest of the beast ...
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#972498 - 04/19/10 01:38 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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Frank Griffith
Planeteer/Artist # 300
Planeteer
Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 12363
Loc: "All Be Quirky", NM
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I'm just guessing here but there should be a way to remove several screws on the inside that holds the top panel to the guts of the VS. Once you figure that out, you should be able to get under the fader board section. Good luck.
_________________________
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#972500 - 04/19/10 01:48 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Frank Griffith]
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sean de
Planeteer
Registered: 02/02/06
Posts: 77
Loc: Ireland
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A good old Q-tip with some white spirit on the end squeezed into the groove will bring up a lot of stuff, I keep the 2480 covered always
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ONE LIFE, LIVE IT NOW,
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#972503 - 04/19/10 01:53 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Frank Griffith]
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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Here is a link to what it looks like . 10mpix view with my DSLR . http://share.ovi.com/download.aspx?media=madbrain.15973
The fader board is on the bottom right.
I removed the HD, CD, and one horizontal holding bar at the bottom.
But now I have the following problem ... The second horizontal holding bar towards the bottom is screwed to a large metal plate that holds the motherboard on top.
The fader board has some screws that are underneath that large metal plate. To get to them, it appears that I would have to first remove the motherboard on top, then the large metal plate underneath it, then finally the horizontal holding bar.
As I mentioned, several of the connections on the motherboard are very tight. For example the one to the PSU below the VS8F-2 on the left.
Some of the connections on the left of the motherboard are tight too.
I don't know if any of them is really soldered, but they don't easily come off.
I found a link to a document about the 2480.
See page 6 and 7 there : http://www.rolandvs2480.net/VS2480CD%20t...a%202480DVD.pdf
It seems the fader board there doesn't overlap with anything, it is only covered by a large metal plate on the bottom right.
I guess the lack of overlap is because the 2480 is so much larger than the 2400 (that was one of the key reasons I bought the 2400 and not the 2480).
Sigh.
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#972509 - 04/19/10 02:24 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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Frank,
Because of the odd shape of the top VS cover, and the fact that it's all one piece, it doesn't appear that it can be removed without first taking out everything else inside one piece at a time. I'd love to be wrong about that, but that's what it looks to me.
I have put the beast back together, at least momentarily. I feel like I had the ability to do more damage than good at this point. At least I didn't find much dust/cat hair inside the unit itself. It must be all concentrated in the fader board. I will try the q tip approach from above with the unit closed and see if that helps.
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#972525 - 04/19/10 03:43 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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Mike Musgrove
Planeteer
Registered: 05/06/03
Posts: 4313
Loc: DFW Texas
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I had to have all the motors replaced on one. It wasn't that pricey. The Q tip thing might be the best bet. In the event you don't know the short-term work around, hit the input faders button and mix with the mouse and the monitor. That way the fader movement won't have any effect on the mix.
_________________________
Mike Musgrove
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#972541 - 04/19/10 05:26 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Mike Musgrove]
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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I was not able to accomplish much with the q-tip method. Without direct access to the fader board, it doesn't have any effect. It picked up some fat hair, but not much.
Mike, I'm not completely clear on your workaround. Which "input faders" button are you referring to ?
What was the total cost of the fader replacement, including shipping and labor ? I may just need to go that route. And buy a good cover.
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#972544 - 04/19/10 06:19 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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I was very daring tonight and sprayed some Radio shack anti-corrosive lubricant spray through the fader openings on top of the VS. And what do you know - they all work perfectly now, and fast ! I hope this is a permanent fix and they still work tomorrow ... For now I'm happy.
I had this product handy at home from trying to fix a pair of keyboards, which also fell victim to cat hair. I was unsuccessful, unfortunately. But somebody more skilled at fixing electronics than me bought them last year.
I don't know if RS still make this - it doesn't show on their website, but for those other daring folks, it is product 640-0057
Now excuse me while I take a deep breath away from this toxic shit.
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#972571 - 04/19/10 12:01 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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headwerkn2
Planeteer
Registered: 01/10/08
Posts: 638
Loc: The Countryside, Tasmania
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Get rid of the cats. Useless animals, can't even fetch anything.
;-)
_________________________
Back to analog, gentlemen... Tascam 688, Teac A3440S, Teac 2A, Teac MB20, Akai X-160D, Teac A-350 Currently seeking - Teac 5A and 5EX mixer, Revox C270/C278 or Otari 5050-2 and 5050-8 track RTR decks - Please PM! Digital stuff... Digi001, Mbox 2 Mini, Protools, Logic, iPad 3.
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#972626 - 04/19/10 05:50 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: headwerkn2]
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Frank Griffith
Planeteer/Artist # 300
Planeteer
Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 12363
Loc: "All Be Quirky", NM
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Keep the VS covered and the cats out of the studio, I know, hair will still float that direction. You can also use cheese cloth to filter the air that comes thru the air ducts and vents into the studio, that will catch the hair.
I would be careful using the Radio shack anti-corrosive lubricant spray, some times spray lubricants have chemicals in them that can melt rubber and plastic parts like what are in the motorized faders. Keep us posted. ltr..
_________________________
"MORE GUITARS" VS2480DVD,3-VS8F-2/1-VS8F-3 & 5 plugins+Auto-Tune,MassHiRes EQ,UA Bundle,Chrometone,Soundblender/TC Reverb,T-Racks.Dyns BM5A's,Roland DS50A's,M-Audio 2.1,PreSonus TubePre w/Rode NT1000,SM57&58,MXL V57&V67,B-5,XV5050,Yamaha P200,Oxygen8 V2,Behring V-amps,SansAmp DI, Taylor,Gibsons,Fender,Ric,Washburn Bass.2 RPC-1's,PC Sonar 4, Acid 5, Wavelab etc.
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#972680 - 04/19/10 07:40 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Frank Griffith]
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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Frank,
Well, my "studio" is a 10x10 home office, one of 3 bedrooms in the house. One of the cats' favorite sleeping places is on the office chair. And she loves to jump everywhere, including on the VS.
The cats are indoor cats so I don't really want to restrict their living space too much, it's already quite limited.
Does anyone know where to get a cover for the VS-2400 ?
Same question for Yamaha KX-61 keyboards, a pair of which I acquired last year to replace the dead keyboards.
Same question for Roland FP-3 digital piano.
I already have a cover for my Schimmel 5'7 grand piano in the master BR fortunately, for an instrument that price I bought it from day 1 The cats still love to jump on top of it.
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#972697 - 04/19/10 08:00 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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TrumpetPlayingMan
Planeteer
Registered: 03/05/08
Posts: 392
Loc: 53or4or5N 3or4or5W
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I just throw a suitable cloth over my 2480... keeps the hairs of the 5 cats off it adequately...
Edited by TrumpetPlayingMan (04/19/10 08:02 PM) Edit Reason: I must remove my signature, now that I don't frequent the political forum... PS: we're having a REALLY INTERESTING election over here... ;-) ... yes... I DO mean it...!!
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#972738 - 04/19/10 10:22 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: TrumpetPlayingMan]
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Mark Oakley
Planeteer
Registered: 10/09/02
Posts: 1196
Loc: Beaverton, Ontario
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I'm not much of a repair tech, but I bought and installed a new(er) Fader Board in my 2480. When some of the faders on this board wern't tracking properly, I de-soldered and installed some of the working faders from my old Fader Board. I didn't find it all that hard, if you work carefully.
I'd be very interested in knowing more about the Radio Shack spray that can bring Faders back to life. A friend of mine has a hardly used 2480, and the Faders are lightning fast compared to mine. What's the brand name of this product?
-Mark
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#972790 - 04/20/10 12:01 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Mark Oakley]
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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Mark,
It was a Radioshack brand spray. I posted the product number earlier , 640-0057 . It doesn't seem to be made anymore though But maybe some stores still have it. The name is "anti-corrosive lubricant spray". The composition is listed there : http://www.radioshack.com/graphics/uc/rsk/Support/MSDS/6400057_MSDS.pdf .
There might be similar products available still. Radioshack still has some sprays, but not under its own brand.
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#972806 - 04/20/10 12:27 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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Mike Musgrove
Planeteer
Registered: 05/06/03
Posts: 4313
Loc: DFW Texas
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Mike, I'm not completely clear on your workaround. Which "input faders" button are you referring to ?
What was the total cost of the fader replacement, including shipping and labor ? I may just need to go that route. And buy a good cover.
If you set the faders for the INPUT tracks, their mechanical movement...or lack of movement...won't interfere with your MIX. You can still adjust the TRACK faders via the monitor with a mouse.
There's a place in Dallas that did the work for me. I think all in it was around $150. I live in Fort Worth, so there was no shipping. Not sure where you're at but find and authorized Roland repair shop and give them a call.
My memory is that unless your very lucky, the faders will get worse with time.
_________________________
Mike Musgrove
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#972852 - 04/20/10 06:56 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Mike Musgrove]
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madbrain
Planeteer
Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 206
Loc: San Jose, California
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Mike,
I think I get it, but then if I want to change the levels for INPUT, I would have to set the faders to TRACK, and set them with the mouse too, right ?
I guess that's an option at home. But when I go to record I don't take a mouse. I actually can't use a regular mouse due to lingering tendinitis. I use a large trackball - Kensington Expert mouse - but it's not convenient to travel with on top of the VS.
Anyway, my VS fader problem since taken care of for now.
Now, I just discovered fader #1 on my VM3100Pro is bad. We are talking regular fader here - not motorized. It's just not registering any level change 
Does anyone know if there is another way to set the level than the channel fader on the VM ? Otherwise that means 2 of the 20 channels are pretty much useless - channels #1 and #13.
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#972858 - 04/20/10 08:55 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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headwerkn2
Planeteer
Registered: 01/10/08
Posts: 638
Loc: The Countryside, Tasmania
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Be very careful of what you squirt into any fader - it's easy to make the problem worse if you use the wrong product. I'd suggest passing on Radio Shack and getting a specialist fader cleaner from a pro audio shop instead. It'll invariably cost more but at least you'll be sure it will be safe to use. I'd wager that the faders in the VSes are carbon track types but triple check just in case they're conductive plastic track types. Hopefully someone here can give you a definite answer.
I just use a non-linty towel as a cover for my VS, found a promotional towel from some drug company that is the same width, keeps the hair, dust and farts out of recorder nicely.
_________________________
Back to analog, gentlemen... Tascam 688, Teac A3440S, Teac 2A, Teac MB20, Akai X-160D, Teac A-350 Currently seeking - Teac 5A and 5EX mixer, Revox C270/C278 or Otari 5050-2 and 5050-8 track RTR decks - Please PM! Digital stuff... Digi001, Mbox 2 Mini, Protools, Logic, iPad 3.
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#972885 - 04/20/10 02:07 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: madbrain]
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FalconEddy
Retired Mastering Marvel
Planeteer
Registered: 10/16/01
Posts: 10800
Loc: Litchfield, NH, USA
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Mark, It was a Radioshack brand spray. I posted the product number earlier , 640-0057 . It doesn't seem to be made anymore though  But maybe some stores still have it. The name is "anti-corrosive lubricant spray". The composition is listed there : http://www.radioshack.com/graphics/uc/rsk/Support/MSDS/6400057_MSDS.pdf . There might be similar products available still. Radioshack still has some sprays, but not under its own brand.
Obviously, this product is not made by Radio Shack (The Shack). It's produced by CAIG Labs where it's known as MechanicALL.
Available in different strengths (as are many of CAIG's products) - 5%, 100%, spray, drops.
It's actually a petroleum-based penetrating fluid that should be used strictly for the freeing and lubrication of METAL mechanical parts.
The Panasonic made 60mm motorized faders on the VS series DAW's have plastic gears/belts and utilize a conductive plastic contact area that varies the resistance based on the faders position.
I would recommend using a cleaning/lubrication solution that's compatible with plastics and conductive plastics, and not something that may eventually chemically breakdown the plastics and cause complete component failure.
I had heard several years ago that the faders used in the 2480 were motorized optical faders, but I've never attempted to substantiate or disprove that information.
. . Falcon
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. . . but, what do I know?
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#973063 - 04/20/10 09:55 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: FalconEddy]
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Dragon Note Recording Studios
Space Cadet
Registered: 08/21/07
Posts: 5
Loc: Big Flats, NY
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Does anyone know where I can purchase the fader board? Roland only? Part #? Need to do this now.
Edited by Dragon Note Recording Studios (04/20/10 09:55 PM)
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#973073 - 04/20/10 10:10 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Dragon Note Recording Studios]
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Frank Griffith
Planeteer/Artist # 300
Planeteer
Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 12363
Loc: "All Be Quirky", NM
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This is what I found in the archives>>>> http://www.vsplanet.com/ubbthreads/ubbth...true#Post436068 I searched BPM but no VS boards came up as far as I could see. Ltr...
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"MORE GUITARS" VS2480DVD,3-VS8F-2/1-VS8F-3 & 5 plugins+Auto-Tune,MassHiRes EQ,UA Bundle,Chrometone,Soundblender/TC Reverb,T-Racks.Dyns BM5A's,Roland DS50A's,M-Audio 2.1,PreSonus TubePre w/Rode NT1000,SM57&58,MXL V57&V67,B-5,XV5050,Yamaha P200,Oxygen8 V2,Behring V-amps,SansAmp DI, Taylor,Gibsons,Fender,Ric,Washburn Bass.2 RPC-1's,PC Sonar 4, Acid 5, Wavelab etc.
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#973076 - 04/20/10 10:27 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Frank Griffith]
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Dragon Note Recording Studios
Space Cadet
Registered: 08/21/07
Posts: 5
Loc: Big Flats, NY
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Frank, thanks. I was a Roland Dealer for 15 years...duh. I just contacted a friend of mine at Roland, I will keep everyone posted.
Thanks!!
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#973087 - 04/20/10 11:40 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Dragon Note Recording Studios]
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FalconEddy
Retired Mastering Marvel
Planeteer
Registered: 10/16/01
Posts: 10800
Loc: Litchfield, NH, USA
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Does anyone know where I can purchase the fader board? Roland only? Part #? Need to do this now.
Sorry. . .just saw this.
I believe the VS-2480 fader circuit board assembly is actually a combination Fader Board (17 motorized faders) & Panel L Board (for the encoders and LED switches mounted above the faders).
Part #71561767
. . Falcon
_________________________
. . . but, what do I know?
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#973092 - 04/20/10 11:50 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Dragon Note Recording Studios]
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FalconEddy
Retired Mastering Marvel
Planeteer
Registered: 10/16/01
Posts: 10800
Loc: Litchfield, NH, USA
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Does anyone know where I can purchase the fader board? Roland only? Part #? Need to do this now.
If you're going to trash that old quirky/broken fader board, may I please have it for forensic purposes?
I'd be happy to pay shipping charges, etc.
Let me know.
. . Falcon
_________________________
. . . but, what do I know?
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#973119 - 04/21/10 01:08 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: FalconEddy]
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Frank Griffith
Planeteer/Artist # 300
Planeteer
Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 12363
Loc: "All Be Quirky", NM
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Where do you find this fader board, Part #71561767,Roland?
Edited by Frank Griffith (04/21/10 01:08 AM)
_________________________
"MORE GUITARS" VS2480DVD,3-VS8F-2/1-VS8F-3 & 5 plugins+Auto-Tune,MassHiRes EQ,UA Bundle,Chrometone,Soundblender/TC Reverb,T-Racks.Dyns BM5A's,Roland DS50A's,M-Audio 2.1,PreSonus TubePre w/Rode NT1000,SM57&58,MXL V57&V67,B-5,XV5050,Yamaha P200,Oxygen8 V2,Behring V-amps,SansAmp DI, Taylor,Gibsons,Fender,Ric,Washburn Bass.2 RPC-1's,PC Sonar 4, Acid 5, Wavelab etc.
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#973181 - 04/21/10 05:31 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Frank Griffith]
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FalconEddy
Retired Mastering Marvel
Planeteer
Registered: 10/16/01
Posts: 10800
Loc: Litchfield, NH, USA
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Where do you find this fader board, Part #71561767,Roland?
Not 100% sure since I've never needed to purchase one.
I don't know if they'd sell the board directly to an end user; but, I also don't see why not. Especially since the 2480 is well out of warranty at this point.
. . Falcon
_________________________
. . . but, what do I know?
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#974102 - 04/24/10 02:19 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: FalconEddy]
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C Jo Go
EMERITUS ~ VS Roland
Loquacious Planeteer
Registered: 11/05/01
Posts: 38910
Loc: carmel valley,ca
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I gave up after awhile -- was nearly $600 with full install & shipping from Roland,,,, the lube only lasted a short time and made things even more sluggish .....
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#974135 - 04/24/10 03:32 AM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: C Jo Go]
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Starliner
Planeteer
Registered: 05/19/09
Posts: 3178
Loc: Florida - Dunnellon
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Go to caig.com and / or deoxit.com. Many techs use their stuff on Neve consoles and high-end gear. Their staff can offer suggestions for the best chemicals to use, based on your application. Keep in mind a cleaner that contains no lube will actually stiffen the operation instead of improving it... therefore you need to use a lube to restore smooth operation.
If the faders are worn or damaged, cleaner and lube is only a temporary solution, but it could last quite a while before acting up again. Sometimes, if the wrong cleaner or lube is used initially, it can be removed by the appropriate cleaner. This is provided that the original cleaner / lube has not caused damage on it's own.
Starliner
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Half The Lies They Tell About Me Aren't True!
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#1941279 - 11/10/24 09:05 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: Starliner]
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gre
Planeteer
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 147
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Old thread but where exactly would you put the grease/lube on the fader?
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#1942219 - 11/15/24 03:15 PM
Re: sticky faders
[Re: gre]
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MScott906
Planeteer
Registered: 12/16/20
Posts: 36
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This is not likely what you want to hear, but the best and most lasting way to get the faders back to "factory" is to make them back to factory: Take the unit apart and take the fader board our, and once disassembled, using a combination of tweezers, picks, some canned air (keep the can upright at all times), get all of the garbage out of the faders. Spraying any kind of liquid into the faders is only going to make things worse, even if it seems to work in the short term, it will be short, and it will ultimately make the problem worse. The faders didnt come from the factory with liquid in them, so saturating the decades of built-up dust, hair, etc. is not going to fix anything.
_________________________
VS-2480, VS-2400CD, MV8000 w/ MV8-OP1, XV-5080, S-550, MC-909, V-Synth, Fantom 6S, Akai Renaissance MPC
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